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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Dinah on February 18, 2005, at 11:52:11
In reply to Useful psychology and psychotherapy books, posted by Dinah on September 22, 2004, at 20:15:16
I am perhaps being premature here, because I've just started the book and may find by the end that I hate it.
But I'm reading "The Anatomy of Dependence". While this is, to some extent, a commentary on Japanese culture, it is also an exploration of the concept of "amae", a word for which there is apparently no adequate English equivilant.
But it awakes in me an excitement that is based on the idea of limitations in Western language and concepts to explain what are probably universal conditions. And that if we had a different language, we might view things differently. Or that pathology may be, to some degree, a matter of cultural biases and language limitations.
Posted by Dinah on March 17, 2005, at 22:14:56
In reply to Book I absolutely should not read but surely will, posted by Dinah on January 23, 2005, at 19:48:05
Well, my copy of "The Dependent Patient: A Practitioner's Guide" came in. And it didn't scare me silly in the way I thought it would. You know, I thought it would be one of those books that would tell therapists how to set firm boundaries with the clients from h*ll that they all hate to see. But so far it's not that at all.
Now it's scaring me in a completely different way. I am having this intense ah-hah moment of enlightenment.
It talks about how dependent personalities don't always present in the stereotypical passive and helpless way, and that the DSM-IV makes it difficult for practitioners to correctly assess dependency by insisting on linking dependency with passivity and helplessness.
"Persons who are highly motivated to seek guidance and support will use a variety of relationship-facilitating self-presentation strategies to strengthen ties to potential caregivers and maximize the probability that they will obtain the protection and support that they desire."
It explains so very many things about my life. I have been absolutely relentless and singleminded about maintaining dependency. It's just that the way to do that in my family of origin had nothing to do with appearing passive or helpless. So it would appear on the surface that I'm overly detached and care little about attaching to others (with the startling exception of my therapist). I'm not at all compliant with the people I'm dependent on. But when thinking about the reality of life with my parents, and teachers, etc. it's clear that my behaviors have always been designed to bring the approval of and attachment to authority figures.
My attachment to my therapist is not an anomaly at all. It's just that different behaviors elicit the desired outcome with him than with other authority figures, so I modify my behavior accordingly. And he has allowed me to get my way in this. He's completely caved in to my dependency needs. And it's not that they haven't been met in my life. They've been met with astonishing regularity. Every ounce of my not inconsiderable intellect has revolved around getting those needs met, and I've managed to achieve my goals as often as not.
D*mned if I'm going to share this insight with my therapist though. It might cause him to yank away the dependency rug, and I just can't bear that. Especially since I've lost the other main person I was dependent on - my father. Ok, that was a weird mutually beneficial, mutually dependent, symbiotic relationship. But still...
Posted by Susan47 on March 18, 2005, at 9:09:28
In reply to Useful psychology and psychotherapy books, posted by Dinah on March 17, 2005, at 22:14:56
Thank you for your post on this book, Dinah.. I'm going to look into getting it. Wishing my ex-T had known how to handle the situation isn't going to change anything, wishing won't change anything but maybe knowledge will.
Posted by Susan47 on March 18, 2005, at 9:12:18
In reply to Useful psychology and psychotherapy books, posted by Dinah on March 17, 2005, at 22:14:56
Darn I can't search inside the book, is it a good read? I mean, you know, does it flow well? Like for example, Yalom?
Posted by gardenergirl on March 18, 2005, at 13:50:26
In reply to Useful psychology and psychotherapy books, posted by Dinah on March 17, 2005, at 22:14:56
Just added this to my Amazon wish list. I should ask my dad for a gift card to Amazon this year instead of Target or Pier One like he usually does. Imagine how high the pile of books on my nightstand would get!
Thanks for the update.
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on March 18, 2005, at 14:58:40
In reply to Re: Useful psychology and psychotherapy books » Dinah, posted by gardenergirl on March 18, 2005, at 13:50:26
And I can't get out! I think I even have two Amazon windows open...
Somebody call shopping 911! Booksaholics! I need an intervention fast! Please, tough love!
;)
gg
Posted by daisym on March 18, 2005, at 18:43:20
In reply to In fact, help..I've been sucked into Amazon!, posted by gardenergirl on March 18, 2005, at 14:58:40
If you buy a new one, you must give away an old one. If you finish one, you can then buy another new one. Unless you find the one you want on sale. And then you can buy it right then. Or if the moon is up and the book was facing east...then you can buy it. Or, it was in black ink on the web page...then -- well you get the picture.
I finally put a bookshelf next to my side of the bed since the night stand was too full. Now the bookshelf is full, I need another one.
Posted by gardenergirl on March 18, 2005, at 19:33:21
In reply to Rules about books » gardenergirl, posted by daisym on March 18, 2005, at 18:43:20
Um, I've been calling it a nightstand, but it's really a bookshelf! And it's full! Although admittedly, a CD player takes up one of the shelves. Gotta have my peaceful white noise...
Good rules, though.
Do you think 47 is too many for a wish list? Gah!
Thanks,
gg
Posted by Dinah on March 18, 2005, at 22:43:49
In reply to Rules about books » gardenergirl, posted by daisym on March 18, 2005, at 18:43:20
lol. Our bedroom is small, and my husband gave me one of my son's old rolling diaper carts to keep the books I have yet to read on. It collapsed under the weight. :)
So while we're redoing the library, I'm intending to put in a new system. I've got all the books on a database, and I'll just mark the ones I haven't read yet, then go hunt them up on the bookshelves if I want to read them. Hmmm... I'll have to add a half finished checkmark. I usually start all my new books and have thirty or forty half read ones lying about all over.
Posted by Dinah on March 18, 2005, at 22:49:30
In reply to Help, Dinah » Dinah, posted by Susan47 on March 18, 2005, at 9:12:18
No, it's no Yalom.
It's very clinical in tone, so far at least - and I'm halfway through.
When I was discussing it with my therapist today I couldn't remember half of the right words and I wasn't sure I was getting my point across. But from his responses, I think I probably did ok.
He seemed to agree with me. Perhaps it's something he's always known about me. But he sees how it could be playing a big role in my work motivation problems.
Geesh. You'd think the reward of getting paid would be enough. Got to get the income to buy those books, after all.
(Oh, and most importantly, he said that he wouldn't decide that because I was dependent, he'd have to peck me out of the nest. He says that any weaning to be done will be done by me, not him. He's not going to push me to do anything I don't want to do.)
Posted by Susan47 on March 19, 2005, at 0:12:43
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » Susan47, posted by Dinah on March 18, 2005, at 22:49:30
(Sigh) What a sweetheart.
I'll let you finish the book for me, then. I can probably get by without reading it. I've got to crack down on my homework and I just cut myself with a big kitchen knife, accidentally put my finger right smack on it I have really charp knives and this is like my sixth cutting accident. Finger's swollen, cold, can't get it to stop hurting and it gushes blood but I'm not going to Emerg, it'll be a zoo tonight, they'll have me there probably three or four hours min, and I won't get my homework done. I don't know. Can a deep cut heal itself without getting infected? Sheesh I should just go no I'll take Advil.
Posted by Dinah on March 19, 2005, at 8:59:31
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah, posted by Susan47 on March 19, 2005, at 0:12:43
If you think you need stitches, then go.
I hurt my finger with a straight edged razor a while back (a genuine craft related accident involving a barbie) and *did* go into the late night urgent care place. It ended up not needing stitches but the finger tip's been a bit odd and tingly ever since and that was months ago.
I vote for go.
Posted by Susan47 on March 19, 2005, at 9:58:11
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » Susan47, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2005, at 8:59:31
You damaged some nerves. I pasted mine together with a bandaid and it stopped bleeding and it only hurts when I take the bandaid off, like this morning after my shower. I didn't look at it, I'm keeping it tightly together and hoping it doesn't infect. I don't think it will. If I get it wet it'll start bleeding so I'm just being careful not too. But I think it'll be okay, thanks Dinah, I slept with it last night and it didn't start bleeding so Yay. I'm sorry about your finger. How long did it take to heal yours?
Posted by cubic_me on March 19, 2005, at 12:55:44
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah, posted by Susan47 on March 19, 2005, at 9:58:11
I cut the tip of my finger severely when it went straight down onto a kife blade when I reached into the dishwasher. I held it together with bandaids, when blood seeped out through the first I put more on and so on. I didn't take them off for 24hours, then changed it daily after that. It didn't get infected, and although I lost a little sensation in it for a month or so it is fine now.
I hope your recovers ok susan, just take care of it.
Posted by Susan47 on March 19, 2005, at 16:30:08
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » Susan47, posted by cubic_me on March 19, 2005, at 12:55:44
Thank you cubic me. I'm pretty sure it'll be fine. It was a clean cut, very sharp knife, and as long as I keep the edges and the flesh together I'm sure it'll heal well. I have those finger cots; dishes, doing the dishes, that germy yucky job I hate it, that's the one that'll cause problems if anything will. I used to have a dishwasher. Now it's me. :)
Posted by gardenergirl on March 19, 2005, at 18:26:42
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » cubic_me, posted by Susan47 on March 19, 2005, at 16:30:08
Use some with the bandaid. Not too much or the pad will get soggy. But it helps.
I cut my finger cleaning a pill cutter. Very stupid, not thinking.."oh, look this side needs it too!" rub rub rub, ouch!
I had a hard getting it to stop bleeding, too. I had to use ice, pressure, and hold it higher than my heart for a good 20 minutes. I thought I was going to have to get a stitch or two, but I had a plane to catch. Fortunately, it stopped bleeding, I put a bandage on it with a blob of neosporin, which I used every time I changed the bandage.
gg
Posted by Susan47 on March 19, 2005, at 21:40:08
In reply to Neosporin » Susan47, posted by gardenergirl on March 19, 2005, at 18:26:42
Thanks for the reminder, I'll do that next time I change the bandaid :)
Posted by Dinah on March 20, 2005, at 0:11:06
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » Susan47, posted by cubic_me on March 19, 2005, at 12:55:44
Oh, glad to hear those nerves regenerate. It's really obvious that my fingertip isn't back to normal when I type. But maybe soon.
They did teach me in the urgent care place how to stop the bleeding. You hold the finger well below the cut, down by the base, so long and so hard that it turns cold and pale (or so it seemed to me) and hurts like the dickens. It took much longer than they thought but it did work.
Posted by Susan47 on March 20, 2005, at 11:53:15
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » cubic_me, posted by Dinah on March 20, 2005, at 0:11:06
So all the blood in the tip bleeds out? That makes sense I guess. How long do nerves last without a blood supply? Maybe that's why they were damaged so then it would make sense that they would regenerate. Close your eyes and grow those nerves. Do you think that type of thing works? I've heard of women who grow their breasts by meditating. Hmm.
Posted by cubic_me on March 20, 2005, at 14:52:25
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » cubic_me, posted by Dinah on March 20, 2005, at 0:11:06
> They did teach me in the urgent care place how to stop the bleeding. You hold the finger well below the cut, down by the base, so long and so hard that it turns cold and pale (or so it seemed to me) and hurts like the dickens. It took much longer than they thought but it did work.That could be quite dangerous you know. They stopped teaching the British general public to do that about 20 years ago, when people who had been taught to put tornequets on to stem the blood left them on for too long and limbs had to be amputated. Nerves start to die off after about 10mins, so that could well be why they are affected.
Nowadays it it taught to raise the limb to above heart level and apply pressure with a clean cloth/bandage/dressing and keep adding more dressings on top (rather than removing and replacing them) as the blood soaks through.
Posted by Dinah on March 20, 2005, at 15:40:43
In reply to Re: Help, Dinah » Dinah, posted by cubic_me on March 20, 2005, at 14:52:25
Good grief. I thought it appeared odd that they did that. It hurt like h*ll and the finger changed to a blueish white. They had wrapped it that way, and I had to unwrap it. Ouch Ouch Ouch.
Sigh. Young doctor too.
Posted by Dinah on May 16, 2005, at 20:18:34
In reply to Useful psychology and psychotherapy books, posted by Dinah on March 17, 2005, at 22:14:56
I ended up not liking "The Dependent Patient: A Practitioner's Guide" as much as I had thought. It got too technical in the end, with too few illustrative stories. I live for those stories.
I also scanned "Somatoform Dissociation" and don't understand one word in three. I think I understood enough to see it doesn't apply to me. :( The perils of shopping at Amazon.
I think I'm going to have to figure out what to do with all those extra books that I don't really think I want to re-read or use as a reference. I was always afraid to give them away for fear they would somehow give away my hobby. But now that I've come clean with my therapist, I suppose it wouldn't be such a fearful thing.
I spent the weekend putting up a five shelf bookshelf in my closet, and added a couple of extra shelves. It still doesn't fit my entire Pych book collection. All of the magazines, a few textbooks, the books on the mind/brain, and a few specialized books are still where they used to be. :( I really do need to do a purge.
I have almost no books on dissociation I like. "The Myth of Sanity" and "The Stranger in the Mirror" are the only two that come to mind.
Posted by Crackers on May 27, 2006, at 2:25:42
In reply to Re: My favorite books on dissociation, posted by Dinah on September 22, 2004, at 20:24:11
My male psychologist asked me to read "In Session" when I HAD BEEN TRYING, FOR OVER A MONTH, TO DISCUSS WITH HIM THE ISSUE OF TRANSFERENCE AND COUNTER TRANSFERENCE. I read that book 5 times and couldn't believe what I was reading. To me it sounded like each one of these women in the book were being sexually abused by their pyschologists and that it was useful in therapy. I had to take a month off of therapy with him and spoke to several other councellors and male friends to find out their opinion on certain behaviours my therapists displayed. I then booked an appointment with my therapist to ask him why he asked me to read the book. His defence he thought it would be useful. So I told him my opinion of the book. He apologized and suggested we go out for a smoke together. For the duration of that appointment we stared at each other. Next day, I fired my psychologist. I hadn't had one sexual thought or fantasy about my psychologist but my psychologist insisted on physical contact without asking for consent first. He would also have these subconversations about sex, always discuss my sexual tendencies and try to get me to talk to him on a non professional basis.
Hope this is some help and it's not too late.
Alison B.>An easy subject to start with, because it's a >very short list.
>
> "The Myth of Sanity" by Martha Stout is my very very favorite. This book changed my life. It normalized so many things that scared me before. It is written in a no-nonsense non-sensational manner that is very reassuring. And it talks about milder dissociative experiences that resonate with me. It and "In Session" would be the two books I always want in arms reach.
>
> The other one I like is "The Stranger in the Mirror" by Marlene Steinberg. It is written in a similar straightforward and calm manner and contains some snippets based on Steinberg's dissociative disorder structured clinical interview.
>
> Has anyone read either of these books? If so, what did you think of them? Do you have other dissociative disorders favorites?
Posted by Dinah on May 27, 2006, at 10:57:52
In reply to Re: In Session » Dinah, posted by Crackers on May 27, 2006, at 2:25:42
I'm sorry you had such a bad experience and had a bad reaction to "In Session". My therapist has never stepped a toe out of line, and I'm sure he's not in any way attracted to me. I'm also not at all attracted to him. But I found the book useful in normalizing my strong maternal transference to him, and in discovering what I *didn't* feel for him.
Posted by Crackers on May 27, 2006, at 14:24:31
In reply to Re: In Session » Crackers, posted by Dinah on May 27, 2006, at 10:57:52
Threw my experience I learned not to doubt my self anymore. Glad your therapist didn't jump on to the sofa with you and kick off his shoes. I kept blaming myself until my male friends told me that straight up that they knew me well enough to know I wouldn't have provoked the situation.
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