Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 13038
Shown: posts 1 to 25 of 31. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
Okay, this looks like the perfect group to ask about my current dilemma. Since my mid-teens or before (not sure) I have had some interesting experiences: volatile moods/unecessary emotional intensity/paranoia, depression, visions & vivid dreams, magical belief, hearing "wavy noises" and seeing flashes of light as I awaken, ease in meditation (meaning I rarely have trouble using this to decrease anxiety), difficulty sleeping/remaining asleep/getting enough rest, forgetting familiar words, etc., etc. Never can remember them all at the same moment. ;>
Last year I took an interest in temporal lobe epilepsy due to its supposed connection with some cases of serial murder. This reading led me to realize that a lot of the weird stuff that happens to me fits the description of partial seizures. Current official diagnoses include allergies and asynchronous gonadotropin release (this from a GP), PTSD (years ago from a psychiatrist), depression (from a liscensed therapist), and transitional anxiety or something (from another therapist). What the hey, guys? I'm visiting that last therapist Thursday to ask her opinion and see if she knows any neurologists/psychiatrists who specialize in thinking rather than telling people, "It's all in your head." ( irony) Finding a decent doctor is not easy when you live in Bumble*@#!, AL. :>
Granted, there has been a lot of stress in my life lately. In the last year I have lost a longtime boyfriend, reunited with my abuser in therapy (gradually), stopped smoking with Zyban, stopped Zyban and started smoking again, tried the patch & failed, tried the patch again (successful so far), started exercising again, moved twice (once under unpleasant circumstances), changed jobs twice after briefly working nightshift at an animal ER, lost two pets, gained two more pets..... all of these things could trigger any number of underlying problems.
Great impression to give in a first post! I bet you all think I'm unstable now. I get the feeling it's safe to be honest around here, though. :>
A couple of months ago the sound & light show happened as I awoke. Since then, I've been unusually irritable toward others but not depressed as I understand it. Not suicidal. Usually thinking positively. The bad-mood times for me are first thing in the morning and in the evening trying to go to bed. This cacophany of neurotransmitters is bugging people I love (self included), and needs to be deciphered and treated.
Any ideas? Opinions? Similar experiences?
M.M.
P.S. -- I hope I can return the favor one day soon! :)
Posted by Noa on October 12, 1999, at 23:37:16
In reply to Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
It sounds like it is worth it to get evaluated by a neurologist, as you are going to wonder about it anyway. Is there a university town anywhere close enough to travel to?
Posted by dj on October 13, 1999, at 0:26:50
In reply to Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
Can't say I have much in the way of insight but what a list...low to mid-level depression would not necessarily include suicidal tendencies but disrupted sleeping and eating patterns would be some of the indicators. For a full outline you could check out Dr B's reference page for an appropriate link. One clue may be if you felt better when you were on Zyban which is also know as the anti-depressant Wellbutrin...
>...Current official diagnoses include allergies and asynchronous gonadotropin release (this from a GP), PTSD (years ago from a psychiatrist), depression (from a liscensed therapist), and transitional anxiety or something (from another therapist). ...stopped smoking with Zyban, stopped Zyban and started smoking >again,
Posted by jamie on October 13, 1999, at 3:59:59
In reply to Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
> Any ideas? Opinions? Similar experiences?
Definitely a situation for a specialist, not a GP. All the mental disorders can overlap and have fuzzy bounderies. Your description hints toward treatment with perhaps a mood stabilizer (anti-convulsant) like lamictal and/or an antipsychotic. Not as heavy-duty as it sounds. But a psychiatrist is the first step.
Posted by Racer on October 13, 1999, at 5:29:10
In reply to Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
And you call that stress? Listen, you want stress, I broke a fingernail today... %^P (<<With all that going on, any reaction seems kinda normal to me, in a really weird sense... That's just too much to have on your plate at any one time.As for the epilepsy, that's an intriguing idea, and I really hope you follow up on it and report back.
The symptoms you describe remind me of some of the signs I'm getting depressed, though. The sleep disturbances, the irritibility, the part about forgetting those - you know, what are they called? Oh, yeah - words... Those are usually signs that I'm falling off the floor.
The light show is something else again, though. I don't know much about epilepsy, but it sounds a little beyond simple depression. (How's that for humor? When was depression ever simple?) If it helps you feel a little less alone, I see colors and lights at orgasm. I've been told it's a case of random synaptic activity in the brain with the release of tension. I can't see any mechanism like that in your case, but at least we share the effect.
Good luck to you.
Posted by dove on October 13, 1999, at 11:15:34
In reply to Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
My personal experience (I'm not a Dr. nor any kind of Professional!) with mental/mood disorders includes a history of being misdiagnosed with epilepsy first. I had EEG's, EKG's, MRI's, and a battery of tests/blood-work and all came out negative for epilepsy, my only positive indicators being the questionaire for temporal-lobe. I took Tegretol, was a zombie, had no life, major depression and mood-swings but was too lethargic to do myself 'harm'. Was told that Tegretol was an anti-depressant and it was all in "my head" and that "I needed to grow up."
Enter Internal Medicine specialist, informing me that Migraines were the actual problem (my migraine symptomatology includes bright flashing lights and actual fainting/giving myself concussions). He says I am moody/depressed/suicidal due to my headaches. Taking Verapamil and feeling human for the first time in my life (along w/ no headaches), still dealing with depression ect..but now I think there might hope. Switch from Verpamil (due to side-effects) to Amitriptyline, feel not so human but more energetic and up.
Have my first psychiatric evaluation. [Side-note: I have had ADHD (which keeps being renamed) since 3 yrs.old and as a child they didn't treat (medicate)as they do now.] Psych-evaluation promptly dxed as Bipolar and a number of secondary disorders including OCD, ADHD, PTSD and GAD. Being treated now for these and there is a light in the dark tunnel.
Now to your symptoms:
Bipolar, Atypical Depression, Histrionic Personality disorder along with a number of Personality disorders.Schizo-effective disorder, bipolar mania with schizo(psychotic)-features, the magical belief could also relate to Personality disorder (i.e. histrionic), and Temporal Lobe Epilepsy.Attention-Deficit-spectrum, Bipolar disorder/Mixed-State, Atypical Depression, side-effects from a number of other Personality-Disorders.Strong features of Bipolar/Mixed-State, Attention-Deficit spectrum and any number/combos of Personality/Mood-disorders.I am very interested in your symptomatology, please keep us updated on your results and/or meds initiated. I have characteristics very similar to yours although I have never had the 'magical beliefs' which I associate with the schizo-end of the spectrum, possibly in error?
My depression, anger, frustration ect. is the absolute worst early morning and late night. My Psych-Doc said this is a particular attribute of Bipolar disorder. So, why does he think a CNS Stimulant will help me during those critical hours everyday? Who the heck knows, I don't seem to get the answers I want hear or I'm too dense to comprehend :-) Good knowledge seeking to you!
~dove
Posted by dove on October 13, 1999, at 11:24:14
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by dove on October 13, 1999, at 11:15:34
I screwed up my posting, doh! (I apologize for the previous and for my long-winded scribbling.)
Now to your symptoms:
"Volatile moods/unecessary emotional intensity/paranoia, depression":
Bipolar, Atypical Depression, Histrionic Personality disorder along with a number of Personality disorders.
"Visions & vivid dreams": Sleep disorders, sleep-deprivation, Attention-deficit spectrum, side-effect of other Mental/Personality disorders and/or stress.
"Magical belief, hearing "wavy noises" and seeing flashes of light as I awaken":
Schizo-effective disorder, bipolar mania with schizo(psychotic)-features, the magical belief could also relate to Personality disorder (i.e. histrionic), and Temporal Lobe Epilepsy.
"Difficulty sleeping/remaining asleep/getting enough rest, forgetting familiar words":
Attention-Deficit-spectrum, Bipolar disorder/Mixed-State, Atypical Depression, side-effects from a number of other Personality-Disorders.
"Unusually irritable toward others but not depressed as I understand it. Not suicidal. Usually thinking positively. The bad-mood times for me are first thing in the morning and in the evening trying to go to bed":
Strong features of Bipolar/Mixed-State, Attention-Deficit spectrum and any number/combos of Personality/Mood-disorders.
Posted by Bob on October 13, 1999, at 12:42:14
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what? [Addendum], posted by dove on October 13, 1999, at 11:24:14
Hey, macha!
Stability is overrated.
My two cents,
Bob
Posted by Racer on October 13, 1999, at 16:17:34
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what? [Addendum], posted by dove on October 13, 1999, at 11:24:14
>
> "Magical belief, hearing "wavy noises" and seeing flashes of light as I awaken":
> Schizo-effective disorder, bipolar mania with schizo(psychotic)-features, the magical belief could also relate to Personality disorder (i.e. histrionic), and Temporal Lobe Epilepsy.
I'd look toward something more like migraine for this, and a little farther from the schizo-scale. I know that when I get a migraine, some of the first signs are not pain, but perceptive changes: halos around my peripheral vision, changes in the normal range of sounds around me, lights starting to spherize, etc. When I start to see that, it's Motrin right away, before the pain itself starts. (Once the pain starts, it's way too late to hope to be human for a day or so...)
Good luck
Posted by Noa on October 13, 1999, at 17:54:22
In reply to About 'wavy noises', posted by Racer on October 13, 1999, at 16:17:34
Even if you have a cluster of problems that could be described by an Axis II disorder, such as the personality disorders mentioned above, that doesn't tell you much, nor does it address some of your most bothersome symptoms. I'm with racer. You need to see a neurologist to rule out either migranes or some sort of seizure disorder. I think it is wise to pursue an answer to the symptoms and then see if treating them has an effect on your beliefs about the symptoms. If something of purely physiological (if there is any purity in the brain) is the ruled out as the root of your odd sensations, then you can go the route of exploring a psychological cause for the sensations. But I would first investigate the sensations as a neurological problem, and Racer might be on target.
Posted by macha on October 13, 1999, at 18:21:00
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by Noa on October 12, 1999, at 23:37:16
> It sounds like it is worth it to get evaluated by a neurologist, as you are going to wonder about it anyway. Is there a university town anywhere close enough to travel to?
Could make it to Vanderbilt or UAB pretty easily, yep.
Posted by Elizabeth on October 14, 1999, at 1:14:26
In reply to Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
Hiya.
The "personality disorder" seems like a pretty far-fetched idea to me. If you have a history of childhood trauma or a chaotic childhood, it's possible, but otherwise I'd look elsewhere for answers. Depression, anxiety, and mood swings frequently go along with migraine, epilepsy, and sleep disorders. The vivid dreams might be due to a primary sleep disorder or to fragmented sleep (resulting from nocturnal seizure activity, for example?).
The "wavy noises" and flashes of light sound to me like hypnapompic hallucinations. They're within the realm of normality - unless they cause you difficulty, I wouldn't worry about them too much. They might be signs of an underlying sleep disorder, though. Similarly, the word-finding difficulty could come from poor sleep. The sleep problems, of course, could be caused by anxiety (difficulty getting to sleep) and/or depression (difficulty staying asleep).
"Magical beliefs" caught my eye, and I was wondering if you'd care to elaborate on that (i.e., what sort of beliefs exactly? examples?).
As you no doubt are aware, some people with TLE experience intense religious feelings, often as part of an "aura."
As far as what to do about it, I think a neurologist is the first person to see. He or she may want you to see a psychiatrist (perhaps a sleep specialist) as well.
For what it's worth, I know a young woman who has many of the same symptoms. She failed trials of several antidepressants and finally responded to an anticonvulsant. On the other hand, my doctors thought I had TLE for a long time but settled on panic disorder when I didn't respond to anticonvulsants - so who knows?
Posted by dove on October 14, 1999, at 8:38:52
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by dove on October 13, 1999, at 11:15:34
M.M.
Just wanted to add one more thing, I am obviously biased against the epilepsy dx due to my own personal history. I don't want you to feel like I was dxing you as schizo or anything, no way, just sharing some thoughts on the different symptoms. You didn't mention if you had migraines? There's a connection between migraines and epilepsy theoretically I believe.
Getting a Neuro consult would be very interesting (possibly changing your whole approach) and I would strongly encourage you to give it a go! Take care.
~dove [not trying to step on any toes.]
Posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:16:16
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by dj on October 13, 1999, at 0:26:50
Felt jittery of Zyban and couldn't sleep very well. But didn't want to smoke, either. :> The trade-off wasn't worth it.
Posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:17:41
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by jamie on October 13, 1999, at 3:59:59
My therapist said the same thing today. The next step will be to look for a good psychiatrist, and possibly a neurologist.
Posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:20:43
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by Racer on October 13, 1999, at 5:29:10
>
> If it helps you feel a little less alone, I see colors and lights at orgasm. I've been told it's a case of random synaptic activity in the brain with the release of tension. I can't see any mechanism like that in your case, but at least we share the effect.
(snickering) That's pretty entertaining, Racer. Lights and colors don't always have to be bothersome, now do they?
.
Posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:33:54
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by dove on October 13, 1999, at 11:15:34
Thanks for your interesting replies, Dove. Migraines are a possibility for me, too, since they run in thwe family. So do bipolar disorder (maternal side) and schizophrenia (paternal side). Right now there's no telling what the correct diagnosis is without scans or something.
I have nothing against the idea of incipient schizophrenia except that it's a pain-in-the-butt disease to have and it should have emerged several years ago. No toes damaged with that suggestion. But the schizo genes are definitely there.
That sucks that you were misdiagnosed at first and put on the wrong meds. Feels like a waste of time, doesn't it? I was put on Prozac and ultimately had Little-Red-Riding-Hood hallucinations while driving. They were amusing but very distracting. Prozac was clearly not the right drug.
Posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:35:08
In reply to Stability, posted by Bob on October 13, 1999, at 12:42:14
> Hey, macha!
>
> Stability is overrated.
>
> My two cents,
> Bob
Heheheheheheh............. :D <-- goofy grin
You've got a point, there, BoB!
Posted by Racer on October 14, 1999, at 17:45:58
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:20:43
>
> >
> > If it helps you feel a little less alone, I see colors and lights at orgasm. I've been told it's a case of random synaptic activity in the brain with the release of tension. I can't see any mechanism like that in your case, but at least we share the effect.
>
> (snickering) That's pretty entertaining, Racer. Lights and colors don't always have to be bothersome, now do they?
> .
Hey, I'm just glad I could make you snicker. Guess I won't have to tell you about the time when, at the moment of orgasm, every cell in my body suddenly screamed out the number 32! That one even made me laugh. Not even 42, the answer to the universe...
One thing I notice about a lot of doctors is that they get so frazzled that they lose sight of the whole patient. All of these disorders are linked to a dozen other factors. Sure, I suffer from depression. Sure, I'm under a lot of stress. Don't tell me just to relax, that it's all in my head, that I need to take more time off for myself. There are trade offs one has to make. The time off I take for myself translates into money I don't earn, bills I can't pay, and creditors putting even more stress on me. On the other hand, the more time I put in at work, the more stress builds up, the less productive I get, and the more depressed and stressed I get. So, what's the answer? Is it a different drug? A different financial situation? A different personality?
It's a case of having to balance drugs with new methods of coping with the stress. That's the ideal, and that's what I'm working towards. It sounds as though the first thing for you to do is to find a doctor who will check out your lights, and who will send that little girl in the red hat on her way.
Good luck, and do keep us informed.
Posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:46:06
In reply to Re: Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by Elizabeth on October 14, 1999, at 1:14:26
The hallucinations are kind of fun, really. The only worrisome thing about them is their possible connection with mood swings which cause me to snap at loved ones or break perfectly good writing utensils. ;>
As for the magical beliefs, it would take too long to describe my entire belief system. I practice magic whenever I find it necessary, rather than just for fun the way some witches do. This makes me a Wittan rather than a Wiccan, according to books on the subject. I really do believe that spells work, but not usually in the way people expect them to work. For instance, a protective spell might cause your tormentor's car to crap out in a statistically improbable way. A spell for peace in your life might drive away a previously close friend, leading to the realization that this person had been pretty mean to you, anyway. The beliefs I question most have to do with omens; they smack of paranoia. I'm all the time seeing animals run by and thinking this is an omen and getting a tingly spine, hackles raised, etc..... only to find that nothing significant happens. Unless it's going to happen tomorrow..... or next month.....
See what I mean? Maybe some meds would take care of this. :>
Posted by saint james on October 14, 1999, at 20:46:18
In reply to Epilepsy or what??? Any ideas?, posted by macha on October 12, 1999, at 19:03:33
>
>
> Last year I took an interest in temporal lobe epilepsy due to its supposed connection with some cases of serial murder. This reading led me to realize that a lot of the weird stuff that happens to me fits the description of partial seizures.
James here....
Correct, they do fit the descriptions I have seen.
Epilepsy/seizures are often amissed condition when the signs are not obvious. Get a consult with a neurologist or Pdoc that has treated these conditions.
james
Posted by saint james on October 14, 1999, at 20:58:00
In reply to Magical beliefs, posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:46:06
>
>
> As for the magical beliefs, it would take too long to describe my entire belief system. I practice magic whenever I find it necessary, rather than just for fun the way some witches do
James here....
To me there are 2 kinds of magical beliefs or thoughts. Those caused by a psychological or medical condition and those because of a belief system. I don't think the 2 are really the same.
j
Posted by 2Smart2Say on October 14, 1999, at 21:03:18
In reply to Re: Magical beliefs, posted by saint james on October 14, 1999, at 20:58:00
> >
> >
> > As for the magical beliefs, it would take too long to describe my entire belief system. I practice magic whenever I find it necessary, rather than just for fun the way some witches do
>
> James here....
>
> To me there are 2 kinds of magical beliefs or thoughts. Those caused by a psychological or medical condition and those because of a belief system. I don't think the 2 are really the same.
>
> j
So you're saying that fundamentalist Baptist beliefs are not a mental disorder?
Posted by Elizabeth on October 14, 1999, at 21:31:44
In reply to Magical beliefs, posted by macha on October 14, 1999, at 17:46:06
> The hallucinations are kind of fun, really. The only worrisome thing about them is their possible connection with mood swings which cause me to snap at loved ones or break perfectly good writing utensils. ;>
I bet that all of it - the hallucinations, moodiness, etc. - could be accounted for by inadequate sleep or perhaps some particular sleep disorder. The fact that you find them fun rather than freaky or terrifying suggests it's not a psychosis or anything like that.
> As for the magical beliefs, it would take too long to describe my entire belief system. I practice magic whenever I find it necessary, rather than just for fun the way some witches do. This makes me a Wittan rather than a Wiccan, according to books on the subject. I really do believe that spells work, but not usually in the way people expect them to work. For instance, a protective spell might cause your tormentor's car to crap out in a statistically improbable way. A spell for peace in your life might drive away a previously close friend, leading to the realization that this person had been pretty mean to you, anyway. The beliefs I question most have to do with omens; they smack of paranoia. I'm all the time seeing animals run by and thinking this is an omen and getting a tingly spine, hackles raised, etc..... only to find that nothing significant happens. Unless it's going to happen tomorrow..... or next month.....
>
> See what I mean? Maybe some meds would take care of this. :>
Questions of faith? Nope, I don't know of any meds for that!
Posted by saint james on October 15, 1999, at 0:33:35
In reply to Re: Magical beliefs - to st james, posted by 2Smart2Say on October 14, 1999, at 21:03:18
> So you're saying that fundamentalist Baptist beliefs are not a mental disorder?
James here....
I did not say anything about Baptists, we offer support and education about mental ilness here
so I think it is best to stick to that topic.
j
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