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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:03:49
44f on buspar, perphenazine, prozac, welbutrin.
(prozac perphenazine 10 years now )Currently disabled
with depression, (but don't feel depressed)problem
sleep average of 10(+) hours nightly, plus one or two 3 hour naps during day,
and feel tired all the time. dr. tried provigil.It only worked
for 3 weeks, then pooped out.constantly fighting naps all day.
can't even watch a good movie or read. any suggestions for a new med?
or a herbal mix?Dr, tells me i'm not lazy, as I am
even too tired to lie on the couch, and eat chocolates. (must be
in bed, lites out and sleeping)Note. I can drink a pot of coffee in the morning,
then still fall asleep like a baby.
Posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 9:32:02
In reply to sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:03:49
Sleeping.
Ok, as a street pharmacist here is what I would do -- put you on 40mg of adderall.
Posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 9:36:10
In reply to sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:03:49
.....and lose the prozac, reduce the dose of welbutrin and while we are at it let's take away the buspar.
Posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 9:40:07
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away, posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 9:36:10
.... expose yourself to bright lights early in the morning, around 7 am . and dammit get that body of yours moving. Then get yourself to bed around 9-9:30 pm. WAKE UP
Posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:47:43
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away, posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 9:40:07
> .... expose yourself to bright lights early in the morning, around 7 am . and dammit get that body of yours moving. Then get yourself to bed around 9-9:30 pm. WAKE UP
thanks for the input, about the exercise, in the few hours that i am awake in the morning i do work out for at least 20 minutes, fast walking and weight carrying, still sometimes I will go straight to bed after that. I will suggest adderall to my dr. but isn't that like provigil which didn't work!
thanks again.
vicky
Posted by BekkaH on December 7, 2002, at 15:21:36
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away, posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 9:40:07
Freudian Garter Belt -- That is the funniest screen name I've ever seen. Thanks for giving me a good laugh.
Posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 17:25:42
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:47:43
"Adderall is 1/4 Dextroamphetamine Saccharate;
1/4 Amphetamine Aspartate;
1/4 Dextroamphetamine Sulfate (Dexedrine);
1/4 Amphetamine sulfate (d,l racemic amphetamine= Benzedrine);So a 20 mg pill has 5 mg each of these four different mixed salts of amphetamine." --- www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020425/msgs/104119.html
Posted by sergios_c on December 7, 2002, at 19:09:50
In reply to sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:03:49
> 44f on buspar, perphenazine, prozac, welbutrin.
> (prozac perphenazine 10 years now )Currently disabledHow about slowly discontinuing the perphenazine?
Just an idea.
Posted by vickisnowwhite on December 8, 2002, at 6:50:17
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away » vickisnowwhite, posted by sergios_c on December 7, 2002, at 19:09:50
thanks for all the suggestions!! That probably really is my problem (the number of meds that i do take) I think i will reduce that prozac to 20mg instead of 40, and also take one less perphenazine then I do now. (4mg to 2mg) i tried discontinueing the buspar, but if i have a bad day, i'm back to taking it again.I will definately suggest adderol to my pdoc. it would be so nice to be able to stay up all day, and do things without being sooo damn tired.
thanks again!
Posted by BekkaH on December 8, 2002, at 20:25:59
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away, posted by freudiangarterbelt on December 7, 2002, at 17:25:42
Hello FreudianGarterBelt,
Can you let us in on what your screen name means, or is it a secret?
Bekka
Posted by shar30906 on December 8, 2002, at 23:05:56
In reply to sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:03:49
My heart goes out to you, I totally understand how hard it is to have a life when all you do is sleep. I my self am not far out of disablig depression either. I did not bathe brush my teeth or get out of bed for 4 months, and when I did I was exausted. I have fibromylgia and am wondering if you dont have a disease simullar to it chronic fatigue. I find myself having the same problems with the meds I am taking, Depakote xanax, and oxycotin. I BP2 and suffer from anxiety as well as chronic pain. I find my self in a very hard place. with the meds I sleep about 15 hour per day, with out them I do not sleep for three days, usually and crash on the third day and sleep for over24 hours, heck they put a new roof on my house in a day, 6 men, and I slept thought all the hammering and banging. I feel like I'm in a no win situation no matter what I do.
Other than the side effects from your meds, has you dr. ever considered that you may suffer from chronic fatigue? I believe that you aren't lazy and hope you can find a dr. that will help you manage to stay awake. I have suggested to my dr. that i take stimulants during the day and stop the sleep meds, I would feel so much better if i has the energy to DO something other than sleep
good luck,
shar30906
Posted by vickisnowwhite on December 9, 2002, at 10:25:53
In reply to not lazy, side effects, or CFS » vickisnowwhite, posted by shar30906 on December 8, 2002, at 23:05:56
> My heart goes out to you, I totally understand how hard it is to have a life when all you do is sleep. I my self am not far out of disablig depression either. I did not bathe brush my teeth or get out of bed for 4 months, and when I did I was exausted. I have fibromylgia and am wondering if you dont have a disease simullar to it chronic fatigue. I find myself having the same problems with the meds I am taking, Depakote xanax, and oxycotin. I BP2 and suffer from anxiety as well as chronic pain. I find my self in a very hard place. with the meds I sleep about 15 hour per day, with out them I do not sleep for three days, usually and crash on the third day and sleep for over24 hours, heck they put a new roof on my house in a day, 6 men, and I slept thought all the hammering and banging. I feel like I'm in a no win situation no matter what I do.
> Other than the side effects from your meds, has you dr. ever considered that you may suffer from chronic fatigue? I believe that you aren't lazy and hope you can find a dr. that will help you manage to stay awake. I have suggested to my dr. that i take stimulants during the day and stop the sleep meds, I would feel so much better if i has the energy to DO something other than sleep
> good luck,
> shar30906Thanks for sharing shar30906. yes its terrible to sleep on an off all day long, perhaps I do suffer from cfs, I see the dr. tommorrow and will question him on this possibility. I really believe this tiredness is due to the meds that i take, but i'm really scared to go off of them!! Take care and thanks again for posting
Posted by leslieg on December 9, 2002, at 17:10:46
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 9, 2002, at 10:25:53
Don't rule out other sleeping disorders. Apnea, narcolepsy, restless leg syndrome. It could be med. side effects, or maybe not. (I spent two years wondering why I slept all the time until, duh, I finally went to a sleep doc who discovered I am narcoleptic.)
Even if you sleep after exercise, it still is a Good Thing to do. I know, I've been there.
How much Provigil were you on? I take 200 mg in the am and 100 - 200 mg in the early afternoon. I also drink 2 - 3 cups of coffee. And I can nap quite easily with coffee in my system, thank you very much.
If your pdoc doesn't take your sleepiness seriously, then you must find a doctor who does -- and not one who tells you that your sleepiness is simply the result of depression! That is the main reason it took me 2 years to find my diagnosis!!
Good luck,
Leslie :)> yes its terrible to sleep on an off all day long, perhaps I do suffer from cfs, I see the dr. tommorrow and will question him on this possibility. I really believe this tiredness is due to the meds that i take, but i'm really scared to go off of them!! Take care and thanks again for posting
Posted by IsoM on December 9, 2002, at 17:51:32
In reply to sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 7, 2002, at 9:03:49
As some of the other posters have already given good advice, I won't repeat everything that was said but I agree that you're probably on more meds then you may need & that they may contribute (though not 'cause') your sleepiness. You also need to know what your best time of day is. I could go for power walks first thing in the morning & head straight for bed afterwards. I'm not a morning person at all & all efforts to reset myself to be at my best in the morning ended in failure. A power walk in the late morning or early evening is better for me.
I'm not saying you have narcolepsy, but it's something to consider. Check out the symptoms of narcolepsy here:
http://www.sleepdisorderchannel.net/narcolepsy/
(make sure to read over each othe the pages from the links on the bottom of this page that cover Causes, Symptoms, Diagnosis, & Treatment.)If it sounds like what you have & you think you fit the criteria, see if you can print out some of the info to show your doctor. Many doctors have no idea of what true narcolepsy is - you may need to educate your doctor, which is why I suggest taking the info to him. I found that most think you have to keel over in a dead sleep to have it. The doctor I have now is intelligent & has another narcoleptic patient. He agreed with me that I fit the criteria very well.
I tried Provigil (Alertec, here in Canada) but while it helped me intitailly, it wasn't enough. I also have depression & take Celexa for it, but for the narcolepsy, Provigil & Dexedrine (a stimulant) are needed. Both Provigil & Dexedrine (almost any stimulant really) have antidepressant properties too. I still need a good 9 or more hours of sleep every night, but I no longer take long daytime naps. I, too, could take a couple of Wake-Up pills (caffeine tablets) & still sleep through its effects.
I hope you find the answer soon. I feel like I've lost a great chunk of my life from sleeping it away.
Posted by vickisnowwhite on December 11, 2002, at 12:03:04
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away » vickisnowwhite, posted by IsoM on December 9, 2002, at 17:51:32
> As some of the other posters have already given good advice, I won't repeat everything that was said but I agree that you're probably on more meds then you may need & that they may contribute (though not 'cause') your sleepiness. You also need to know what your best time of day is. I could go for power walks first thing in the morning & head straight for bed afterwards. I'm not a morning person at all & all efforts to reset myself to be at my best in the morning ended in failure. A power walk in the late morning or early evening is better for me.
>
> I'm not saying you have narcolepsy, but it's something to consider. Check out the symptoms of narcolepsy here:
> http://www.sleepdisorderchannel.net/narcolepsy/
> (make sure to read over each othe the pages from the links on the bottom of this page that cover Causes, Symptoms, Diagnosis, & Treatment.)
>
> If it sounds like what you have & you think you fit the criteria, see if you can print out some of the info to show your doctor. Many doctors have no idea of what true narcolepsy is - you may need to educate your doctor, which is why I suggest taking the info to him. I found that most think you have to keel over in a dead sleep to have it. The doctor I have now is intelligent & has another narcoleptic patient. He agreed with me that I fit the criteria very well.
>
> I tried Provigil (Alertec, here in Canada) but while it helped me intitailly, it wasn't enough. I also have depression & take Celexa for it, but for the narcolepsy, Provigil & Dexedrine (a stimulant) are needed. Both Provigil & Dexedrine (almost any stimulant really) have antidepressant properties too. I still need a good 9 or more hours of sleep every night, but I no longer take long daytime naps. I, too, could take a couple of Wake-Up pills (caffeine tablets) & still sleep through its effects.
>
> I hope you find the answer soon. I feel like I've lost a great chunk of my life from sleeping it away.thanks IsoM for the input. Sounds like we have a lot in common with this sleepiness. I have been to a sleep clinic, and they found nothing, but I really
felt that it was useless as it was only one night.
they would have to monitor me in my natural setting
to see how much I sleep. It probably is the medications i take, but the pdoc really thinks i need all these, and when he reduces the doses, it seems i have more bad days, and usually go back to the higher levels. EVeryone I know says i'm sleeping my life away, yet i think i would rather sleep this much then have insomnia. (i quess)
but it would be nice to have life!!
Posted by vickisnowwhite on December 11, 2002, at 12:16:02
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away » vickisnowwhite, posted by leslieg on December 9, 2002, at 17:10:46
> Don't rule out other sleeping disorders. Apnea, narcolepsy, restless leg syndrome. It could be med. side effects, or maybe not. (I spent two years wondering why I slept all the time until, duh, I finally went to a sleep doc who discovered I am narcoleptic.)
>
> Even if you sleep after exercise, it still is a Good Thing to do. I know, I've been there.
>
> How much Provigil were you on? I take 200 mg in the am and 100 - 200 mg in the early afternoon. I also drink 2 - 3 cups of coffee. And I can nap quite easily with coffee in my system, thank you very much.
>
> If your pdoc doesn't take your sleepiness seriously, then you must find a doctor who does -- and not one who tells you that your sleepiness is simply the result of depression! That is the main reason it took me 2 years to find my diagnosis!!
>
> Good luck,
> Leslie :)
>
> > yes its terrible to sleep on an off all day long, perhaps I do suffer from cfs, I see the dr. tommorrow and will question him on this possibility. I really believe this tiredness is due to the meds that i take, but i'm really scared to go off of them!! Take care and thanks again for posting
>
>hi leisig,
iwas on 400mg provigil a day, but it soon wore out and i started napping during the day again. I really hate it that despite taking 2-3 hour naps yesterday i was in the bed last nite at 8pm and woke up at 8am this morning. jjjjjjjjeeeeeeeeeez
this is ridiculous. and after I eat!! forget it, its definately time to lie down. I think it really is the perphenazine, so I have lowered the dose to 2mg a day, so i'm waiting to see if and when this will work.
thanks again for posting!
vicky
Posted by leslieg on December 11, 2002, at 13:15:08
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away, posted by vickisnowwhite on December 11, 2002, at 12:03:04
Narcolepsy is not diagnosed from an overnight sleep study but instead requires a test called MSLT: Multiple Sleep Latency Test. This is basically keeping you at the sleep lab all day, and allowing you to attempt to nap 4 or 5 times that day. You get up to 20 minutes to fall asleep. They have you on monitors to find out how quickly you fall asleep and how quickly REM starts. This is almost always done after the night-time sleep study. To me, this test sounded like hell because you are not allowed to actually nap and you can't have caffiene or leave the building. There was NO WAY I could stay awake like that! The biggest problem for someone like you is that you need to be drug-free. I really wrote this to let you know that you have *not* been adequately tested for narcolepsy. (BTW, I have not had an MSLT as I was 1 month pregnant when mine was scheduled, but it was obvious from my night-time study that I have severe REM sleep disturbance and my doc feels I've an over 90% chance of being a narcoleptic.)
I completely agree with you about wanting to have a life. I used to be a "super-mom", a single mom with 2 special-needs kids and a job that demanded overtime. Now I can't even see how I could be awake long enough to work 20 hours a week from home! And I'm on Provigil. But the Provigil has allowed me to be able to plan meals and make it to the grocery store before we all starve to death (usually). I still need at least 9 hours of sleep in a 24-hour period, and I prefer more!
When I was pregnant and couldn't take drugs and had no more than 2 hours of alertness a day, I decided to go to an accupuncturist for help. It cost too much, but it did help. I wouldn't take the herbs he wanted me to, but after an hour on the table I felt more energized, and that lasted 1 - 2 days. Insurance didn't pay for it, but it does qualify as a medical expense if yours are high enough to itemize.
Good luck,
Leslie G.> thanks IsoM for the input. Sounds like we have a lot in common with this sleepiness. I have been to a sleep clinic, and they found nothing, but I really
> felt that it was useless as it was only one night.
> they would have to monitor me in my natural setting
> to see how much I sleep. It probably is the medications i take, but the pdoc really thinks i need all these, and when he reduces the doses, it seems i have more bad days, and usually go back to the higher levels. EVeryone I know says i'm sleeping my life away, yet i think i would rather sleep this much then have insomnia. (i quess)
> but it would be nice to have life!!
Posted by vickisnowwhite on December 11, 2002, at 16:42:06
In reply to Re: sleeping my life away » vickisnowwhite, posted by leslieg on December 11, 2002, at 13:15:08
> Narcolepsy is not diagnosed from an overnight sleep study but instead requires a test called MSLT: Multiple Sleep Latency Test. This is basically keeping you at the sleep lab all day, and allowing you to attempt to nap 4 or 5 times that day. You get up to 20 minutes to fall asleep. They have you on monitors to find out how quickly you fall asleep and how quickly REM starts. This is almost always done after the night-time sleep study. To me, this test sounded like hell because you are not allowed to actually nap and you can't have caffiene or leave the building. There was NO WAY I could stay awake like that! The biggest problem for someone like you is that you need to be drug-free. I really wrote this to let you know that you have *not* been adequately tested for narcolepsy. (BTW, I have not had an MSLT as I was 1 month pregnant when mine was scheduled, but it was obvious from my night-time study that I have severe REM sleep disturbance and my doc feels I've an over 90% chance of being a narcoleptic.)
>
> I completely agree with you about wanting to have a life. I used to be a "super-mom", a single mom with 2 special-needs kids and a job that demanded overtime. Now I can't even see how I could be awake long enough to work 20 hours a week from home! And I'm on Provigil. But the Provigil has allowed me to be able to plan meals and make it to the grocery store before we all starve to death (usually). I still need at least 9 hours of sleep in a 24-hour period, and I prefer more!
>
> When I was pregnant and couldn't take drugs and had no more than 2 hours of alertness a day, I decided to go to an accupuncturist for help. It cost too much, but it did help. I wouldn't take the herbs he wanted me to, but after an hour on the table I felt more energized, and that lasted 1 - 2 days. Insurance didn't pay for it, but it does qualify as a medical expense if yours are high enough to itemize.
>
> Good luck,
> Leslie G.
>
> > thanks IsoM for the input. Sounds like we have a lot in common with this sleepiness. I have been to a sleep clinic, and they found nothing, but I really
> > felt that it was useless as it was only one night.
> > they would have to monitor me in my natural setting
> > to see how much I sleep. It probably is the medications i take, but the pdoc really thinks i need all these, and when he reduces the doses, it seems i have more bad days, and usually go back to the higher levels. EVeryone I know says i'm sleeping my life away, yet i think i would rather sleep this much then have insomnia. (i quess)
> > but it would be nice to have life!!
> actually i did have a test the next day so it must have been the MSLT. I hated it. They wouldn't let me sleep until they wanted me to sleep, so I had to force myself to stay awake, then for the 15 minutes intervals, i was so exsausted, but couldn't sleep in that short of a time!! you would think that the welbutrin that I'm on, (400mg) and the prozac would give me some energy, but alas i've just taken my 200mg welbutrin dose and the bed is calling me... thanks for your post
>
This is the end of the thread.
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