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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 6248 to 6272 of 10407. Go back in thread:
Posted by poochi on February 1, 2004, at 16:12:12
In reply to This is scarier than I thought , posted by Jennifer on April 25, 2000, at 23:10:39
I would research this drug very thoroughly before starting it. It worked wonderfully for me , but getting off it is insane
Posted by poochi on February 1, 2004, at 16:14:59
In reply to This is scarier than I thought , posted by Jennifer on April 25, 2000, at 23:10:39
oh, and I always took it earlier in the day, because it can keep you up at nite.
Posted by fayeroe on February 1, 2004, at 16:25:46
In reply to Re: Glad to be OFF EFFEXOR!!, posted by poochi on February 1, 2004, at 15:51:30
Hang in there. I'd probably start it back up and taper off alot more gradually.....just take enough to get the zaps to quit and then SLOWLY taper off.....I mean slowly. I took months. Good luck! Pat
Posted by poochi on February 1, 2004, at 17:37:10
In reply to Re: Glad to be OFF EFFEXOR!! » casisill, posted by mercedes on January 29, 2004, at 15:17:06
Forgive the spelling please. Anyone try Benydryl for their withdrawl symptoms? And has anyone while in withdrawl had "sleep paralysis" while taking a nap? Is it just from all the extra stress from the with drawl or what? Thanx for any info, signed going slightly insane.
Oh , and you think I should go back on Effexor on 37.5, every couple of days or so til life becomes bearable again?
thanx in advance
Posted by justjustine on February 1, 2004, at 18:08:58
In reply to Effexor--Benadryll?, posted by poochi on February 1, 2004, at 17:37:10
benadryl helped put me to sleep, but it also zombifies me so i didn't find it very beneficial. i have read others say it helped them - i went from 37 to 0 and i've been really sick for a month now. i started myself on vicodin while my doctor was out of town and we're working it out from there.
i would say that if you feel you have the time, go back on and taper very slowly. 37 one day and maybe 18.5 the next for a week. take very small steps or you will likely get sick! i have my own reasons for my "crash course" - partly the length of time it took me to figure out what was going on and how bad it was. by that time i was 2 weeks off! i'm almost 4 weeks off now, and still ill and have no real idea how much longer this is going to take. so no, i don't recommend going 37 to 0.
best of luck to you - i can tell you that the happiness of feelings coming back is well worth the struggle to me! and you are not going insane - trust me, i've thought i've had stomach ulcers, liver failure, flu, kidney disease, a brain tumor, etc. etc. and crazy sleep problems are the norm in coming off this stuff!
> Forgive the spelling please. Anyone try Benydryl for their withdrawl symptoms? And has anyone while in withdrawl had "sleep paralysis" while taking a nap? Is it just from all the extra stress from the with drawl or what? Thanx for any info, signed going slightly insane.
>
> Oh , and you think I should go back on Effexor on 37.5, every couple of days or so til life becomes bearable again?
> thanx in advance
Posted by lacey2001 on February 1, 2004, at 20:17:43
In reply to Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by jp on October 24, 1999, at 14:59:14
My husband and I want to get pregnant but I don't know if I should come off of Effexor first. Has anybody been pregnant while taking Effexor? I think I want to come off anyway. I get a little sick to my stomach in the evening and quite often. And I have been on for over two months now. I am at 75 mg so maybe after my next pregnancy I may try 37.5 mg. I am going to see a Dr this Friday but just wanted to know what everyone here has to say about it. Any studies done on the effects on embryos?
Thank, Tanya
PS-How do I stop all the emails from these posts? I come to this site everyday anyhow.
Posted by Semi-conscious on February 1, 2004, at 21:43:01
In reply to Re: I'm afraid to go off Effexor,taking 1 1/2 year » Semi-conscious, posted by fayeroe on February 1, 2004, at 14:45:32
> I would change doctors first thing! Mine wouldn't even consider the fact that the Effexor was making me ill. I talked to my pharmacist and with her guidance I reduced the med little by little by little over a long period of time. The only side effect I had was the electrical zaps. Within 24 hours of the first reduction, I could tell that I had feelings again!!! Please keep me up to date on what you do. I'll be rooting for you! Pat
Thanks for the support Pat. I think I will talk about it with my DR. But I definately want to go off of it. I'mafraid,also,because I havebeen taking some sort ofanti-depressant for about 9 years now. But I'll keep you posted fayerose. Taylor
Posted by Dr. Bob on February 1, 2004, at 23:37:35
In reply to Pregnancy and Effexor XR??, posted by lacey2001 on February 1, 2004, at 20:17:43
> PS-How do I stop all the emails from these posts? I come to this site everyday anyhow.
See the first bullet at:
http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/extras.pl
Thanks for your patience,
Bob
Posted by KimberlyDi on February 2, 2004, at 15:09:38
In reply to Re: I'm afraid to go off Effexor,taking 1 1/2 year, posted by Semi-conscious on February 1, 2004, at 7:25:27
Hang in there. From what you have described, it doesn't look like Effexor is effective for you (understatement). Don't worry about the withdrawal. Taper your dosages as gently as you need. It took me a couple of months to go from 300mg to 0mg. You are already seriously nonfunctional. I would plan carefully with your doctor about how you are going to handle the rebound depression. It is serious. Be careful and God Bless!
KDi in TX
> I am going through major depression on this stuff. i have no energy. I cry. i don't get off the couch for a week at a time. Don't bathe, don't so anything, don't care. And I have gained almost 40 pounds in the last 1 1/2 years. i'm taking 175 mg sustained release. I have a very know it all meds prescriber. I'mtaking 3 other night time anit-depressants and I would like to get off all of them. I have no desire for anything in life. I'm empty. I want to go off all, but as bad as I feel now, I can just imagine what I'd be like going through withdrawals. Any suggestions or info? Thanks for your time, Taylor
Posted by misha pooh on February 2, 2004, at 16:12:29
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Highly Overrated, posted by ladylight57 on May 11, 2003, at 20:08:23
i missed a pill once and was all dizzy, tingly, and light headed also for the whole weekend. I got my blood pressure checked - it was ok. I just let it pass but the next time i felt the symptoms i went to my general doctor and he said i was having a panic attack. He prescribed clonopin which is like xanex w/o the "high" feeling - worked great! The effexor did kill my sex drive so i switch to welbutrin. During the switching time i tried to quit my job (thank god i work for my parents), thought it was a good idea to walk about 10 miles b/c i didnt want to touch my moms car, had my fiance break up w/ me (temporarily), and did a private half-assed suicide attempt. The withdrawl/switch was rough to say the least but i am almost happy w/ welbutrin!
Posted by Zellie on February 2, 2004, at 23:10:07
In reply to Pregnancy and Effexor XR??, posted by lacey2001 on February 1, 2004, at 20:17:43
Lacey:
I have read that it is NOT for pregnant or nursing moms. It takes months to get off with the least amount of side-effects, so bear that in mind.
Kindest regards,
Zellie
> My husband and I want to get pregnant but I don't know if I should come off of Effexor first. Has anybody been pregnant while taking Effexor? I think I want to come off anyway. I get a little sick to my stomach in the evening and quite often. And I have been on for over two months now. I am at 75 mg so maybe after my next pregnancy I may try 37.5 mg. I am going to see a Dr this Friday but just wanted to know what everyone here has to say about it. Any studies done on the effects on embryos?
>
> Thank, Tanya
>
> PS-How do I stop all the emails from these posts? I come to this site everyday anyhow.
Posted by Semi-conscious on February 3, 2004, at 0:22:30
In reply to Re: I'm afraid to go off Effexor,taking 1 1/2 year » Semi-conscious, posted by KimberlyDi on February 2, 2004, at 15:09:38
> Hang in there. From what you have described, it doesn't look like Effexor is effective for you (understatement). Don't worry about the withdrawal. Taper your dosages as gently as you need. It took me a couple of months to go from 300mg to 0mg. You are already seriously nonfunctional. I would plan carefully with your doctor about how you are going to handle the rebound depression. It is serious. Be careful and God Bless!
>
> KDi in TX
>
>
>
> > I am going through major depression on this stuff. i have no energy. I cry. i don't get off the couch for a week at a time. Don't bathe, don't so anything, don't care. And I have gained almost 40 pounds in the last 1 1/2 years. i'm taking 175 mg sustained release. I have a very know it all meds prescriber. I'mtaking 3 other night time anit-depressants and I would like to get off all of them. I have no desire for anything in life. I'm empty. I want to go off all, but as bad as I feel now, I can just imagine what I'd be like going through withdrawals. Any suggestions or info? Thanks for your time, Taylor
>
>
Thank you for your response Kimberly!. What does it feel like to be Effexor free? Are you taking any meds now? I've been taking anti-depressant for about 9 years. Do you think I could go off all of them and be okay? I take 4 diferent kinds a day. Weren't anti-depressants intially intended for short term use and then it was suppose to have corrected the problem? Or am I condemned to being dependent on drugs for the rest of my life? You're probably not a Dr. but any information you might have re: those questions, I would be most grateful. Taylor
Posted by Semi-conscious on February 3, 2004, at 0:38:07
In reply to Re: I'm afraid to go off Effexor,taking 1 1/2 year » Semi-conscious, posted by KimberlyDi on February 2, 2004, at 15:09:38
I have been taking Effexor XR 175mg for about a year now. I've taken about 20 different kinds in the last 9 years. It seemed to work okay in the beginning, but I started to become even more depressed. I gained about 30 pounds. I have water retention(bad). I have profound sadness. I don't care about anything. I quit exercising. Half the time I don't bathe or get off the couch. I have an egotistical meds provider who thinks he is always right. If I knew that other people were experiencing these symptoms, then I wouldn't think it was just me. I started to give up thinking there was no hope after trying so many kinds of meds, but Effexor seems to have the worst side effects for me. My Dr. says it doesn't cause water retention. Nothing else has changed in my life as far as diet or pills. How is it that I'm wrong and he's right? Any input would be appreciated. Thanks Taylor
Posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 8:23:16
In reply to Re: Any good experience with Effexor? Scared now! » pyschomom, posted by Sad Panda on January 31, 2004, at 12:07:10
My advice to any-one about to start effexor, paxil, zooloft, luvox, wellbutrin or any SSRI, STOP AND THINK WHAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO DO.
Read a book called Prozac Backlash by Joseph Glen mullen.
There is so much about these drugs that your psychiatrist doesn't know about.
DO NOT TAKE SSRI'S without consulting a psychologist first. On no account accept a prescription from a GP for an SSRI.
YOU ARE PLAYING WITH YOUR LIFE.
Posted by Sad Panda on February 3, 2004, at 8:50:43
In reply to STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN, posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 8:23:16
> My advice to any-one about to start effexor, paxil, zooloft, luvox, wellbutrin or any SSRI, STOP AND THINK WHAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO DO.
>
> Read a book called Prozac Backlash by Joseph Glen mullen.
>
> There is so much about these drugs that your psychiatrist doesn't know about.
>
> DO NOT TAKE SSRI'S without consulting a psychologist first. On no account accept a prescription from a GP for an SSRI.
>
> YOU ARE PLAYING WITH YOUR LIFE.That's an extremists view. I'd be dead now if it wasn't for my GP prescribing me Efexor.
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 9:31:27
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN » on-the-wave, posted by Sad Panda on February 3, 2004, at 8:50:43
Extremist, maybe.
After 3 years on effexor in addition to being cured of my severe anxiety and depression by an amazing psychologist, followed by 2 near fatal withdrawal attempts, i believe my opinion is mildly divergent.
The last 30 months of effexor treatment were a continual knife edge battle against diminishing effacacy and aggravated anxiety, depression, irritability, frustration and severe episodes of rage, etc.
If effexor saved your life, it is interim, it is merely masking some symptoms of an emotional or psychological problem. After a period (I don't know how long)the venlafaxine will stop working. My view is that your nerves will be awash in seratonin which enables you to cope. You WILL encounter a situation where the effexor WILL NOT be able to cope with the physical, psychological and emotional reaction. What will you do? Increase your dose, go off the edge? My advice is find the emotional/psychological problem and deal with it through therapy. The good old fashion PROVEN way. BEFORE THE effexor WEARS OFF.
I am only offering advice. I have been through the mill and have the benefit of experienced objectivity. I gain nothing by offering my advice except to educate people from my mistakes.
I was dead, and now i am alive in every concievable facit of the word. I want to let people now what i suffered and where i am now. I see so many people on this site on varying stages of a journey i have almost completed. Some will make it, however most will never. If I can help one it will be worth all the criticism, rejection and abuse that i am anticipating.
God Bless and good luck
Posted by Semi-conscious on February 3, 2004, at 9:33:40
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN » on-the-wave, posted by Sad Panda on February 3, 2004, at 8:50:43
Please tell me if you have experienced any negative side effects from using Effexor SR. I need corraboration to take to my Dr., so he'll work with me on a plan to go through withdrawals with pain killers or something,. with out calling me 'drug seeking.' Please see my other post too.
Please reply to either post. Thanks, semi-conscious Taylor.
Posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 9:40:43
In reply to EFFEXOR: ANY NEGATIVE SIDE EFFECTS???, posted by Semi-conscious on February 3, 2004, at 9:33:40
Brain zaps, short term memory loss, disorientation, dissiness, increased emotional sensitivity, insomnia, weight gain, irritiability, short temper, rage, feelings of invincability, depression, anxiety, suicidal thoughts, etc, etc, etc.
THIS IS NOT RECURRING DEPRESSION/ANXIETY THEY ARE THE SIDE EFFECTS OF WITHDRAWAL.
Posted by PoohBear on February 3, 2004, at 10:33:08
In reply to STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN, posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 8:23:16
> My advice to any-one about to start effexor, paxil, zooloft, luvox, wellbutrin or any SSRI, STOP AND THINK WHAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO DO.
>
> Read a book called Prozac Backlash by Joseph Glen mullen.
>
> There is so much about these drugs that your psychiatrist doesn't know about.
>
> DO NOT TAKE SSRI'S without consulting a psychologist first. On no account accept a prescription from a GP for an SSRI.
>
> YOU ARE PLAYING WITH YOUR LIFE.This is just one book. Your opinion is yours and as such is valid, but it is irresponsible to say that an entire class of drugs is bad because of one author.
These drugs have helped many, myself included. What do you say to those like myself who have a family history of depression, bipolar and alcoholism? I am nearly 47 and have battled depression, ADHD and the after effects of child abuse all my life.
I have done that through a very strong, personal walk with Christ. But that faith and no amount of prayer helped lift the darkness that was always lurking in the background. Effexor was able to do that. It also helped me for the first time in my life to be able to control my thoughts.
Many come to these boards looking for encouragement and instead go away more discouraged and confused than before because they don't have the ability to weed out the trash from the truth. Are there doctors who dole out drugs like candy without really knowing their effects or if they're really indicated for their patient? As surely as there's another charlatan with some hair-brained idea about the evils of drugs and how we're slowly killing ourselves...
I'd rather live with the drugs and their side effects than the darkness in my mind any day. I will live forever. If my life here is made more effective by the drugs I need to take to help me function normally, but my life is cut short by a few years, what's that in light of eternity?
I refuse to listen to narrow-minded authors with a bone to pick and an ax to grind against something that has helped many and me personally. Perhaps if my mother and her sisters had had Effexor or some of the other SSRI's or meds we take for granted now, they'ed be alive today, instead of dead long before their time.
Tony
Posted by Sad Panda on February 3, 2004, at 11:23:11
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN, posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 9:31:27
> My advice is find the emotional/psychological problem and deal with it through therapy. The good old fashion PROVEN way. BEFORE THE effexor WEARS OFF.
>Therapy with a pdoc would be great! Unfortunately I don't have the money for one......
One thing Efexor has done for me is enabled me to talk about my problems with people. Before Efexor I didn't talk to anyone about my problems, I was just a time bomb ready to go off. I use to wonder why people seemingly & needlesly comitted suicide, but then I got so depressed myself that I realized why...
As for Efexor pooping out, that may or may not happen. Some people need an ever increasing dose of SSRI's/Benzos/Stimulants/MAOIs, some people can have the same dose for years. YMMV as they say.
Cheers,
Panda.
Posted by Zellie on February 3, 2004, at 12:32:51
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN » on-the-wave, posted by PoohBear on February 3, 2004, at 10:33:08
I hear your pain and frustration, PoohBear. Effexor has taken me out of the darkness and anguish, too, when nothing else would, after living 42 years of depression.
I appreciate the fears and concerns of those who have had a bad experience with Effexor, and my compassion and heart go out to all of you in that boat. But, as PoohBear has said, there are some of us who are exceedingly grateful for the tremendous lifesaver that Effexor has been for us. We appreciate hearing about your experiences, and I feel we will learn from them better by just reading about YOUR own life story, rather than by making pejorative statements about the drug.
Kindest regards,
Zellie> > My advice to any-one about to start effexor, paxil, zooloft, luvox, wellbutrin or any SSRI, STOP AND THINK WHAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO DO.
> >
> > Read a book called Prozac Backlash by Joseph Glen mullen.
> >
> > There is so much about these drugs that your psychiatrist doesn't know about.
> >
> > DO NOT TAKE SSRI'S without consulting a psychologist first. On no account accept a prescription from a GP for an SSRI.
> >
> > YOU ARE PLAYING WITH YOUR LIFE.
>
> This is just one book. Your opinion is yours and as such is valid, but it is irresponsible to say that an entire class of drugs is bad because of one author.
>
> These drugs have helped many, myself included. What do you say to those like myself who have a family history of depression, bipolar and alcoholism? I am nearly 47 and have battled depression, ADHD and the after effects of child abuse all my life.
>
> I have done that through a very strong, personal walk with Christ. But that faith and no amount of prayer helped lift the darkness that was always lurking in the background. Effexor was able to do that. It also helped me for the first time in my life to be able to control my thoughts.
>
> Many come to these boards looking for encouragement and instead go away more discouraged and confused than before because they don't have the ability to weed out the trash from the truth. Are there doctors who dole out drugs like candy without really knowing their effects or if they're really indicated for their patient? As surely as there's another charlatan with some hair-brained idea about the evils of drugs and how we're slowly killing ourselves...
>
> I'd rather live with the drugs and their side effects than the darkness in my mind any day. I will live forever. If my life here is made more effective by the drugs I need to take to help me function normally, but my life is cut short by a few years, what's that in light of eternity?
>
> I refuse to listen to narrow-minded authors with a bone to pick and an ax to grind against something that has helped many and me personally. Perhaps if my mother and her sisters had had Effexor or some of the other SSRI's or meds we take for granted now, they'ed be alive today, instead of dead long before their time.
>
> Tony
Posted by jpmjcem on February 3, 2004, at 12:41:26
In reply to Re: Pregnancy and Effexor XR?? » lacey2001, posted by Zellie on February 2, 2004, at 23:10:07
DO NOT USE EFFEXOR XR FOR PREGNANCY OR BREASTFEEDING> I had my first baby boy and he is 7 months old now... but my doctors told me it was safe to use this drug while preg and breastfeeding. This drug caused my son to be dehydrated in the womb. He came out with severe withdrawl from teh Effexor XR and we could have lost him. I will NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER trust a doctor to tell me something is safe during preg like that again. PLEASE DO NOT USE IT! It really harms the fetus and baby!
Posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 13:16:53
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN » on-the-wave, posted by PoohBear on February 3, 2004, at 10:33:08
You to are entitled to your opinion, but be sure it is an informed opinion and not a view blinkered by your current status quo.
My point and the point of the book in question (which i admit i have not completed yet)is that there are several KNOWN effects of these drugs which are sometimes ignored.
Firstly the generally accepted initial physical side affects, which in most cases far outweigh the psychological benefits of SSRI's.
Secondly and far more importantly, SSRI's DO WEAR OFF over time. I started on 75mg effexor and eventually peaked at 300mg which i stayed on for 3 years. Once the inital affects (maximised at 150mg) started to wear off, it became a constant battle to maintain an equilibrium state of existance. This existance included bouts of uncontrolled rage, physically damaging myself and property, anxiety attacks and depression. Was this a mini-withdrawal due to the effectiveness wearing off and to physical reactions which the current dose could not cope with? Having gone through withdrawal, I can almost guarantee that it was. Increasing the dosage as i did had minimal effect, but i never achieved the same benefits i experienced when i first used effexor. (I note that I was on Luvox at increasing dosages for about 3 months with absolutely no effect before switching to effexor I stopped increasing the effexor at 300mg because i couldn't afford the monthly expense.).
Macmullen raises the question as to what happens when the drug starts to wear off? There is no correct answer to this question, because nobody is addressing the issue. What will you do?
Thirdly do SSRI's cause brain damage? No-one can say "no it doesn't" just as no-one can prove it does. Just be sure you are aware of the risk, the current information, etc. when you take the decision to start.
Fourthly, what are the physical effects of tolerance to inhibiting seratonin up-take. Once your nervous system is accustomed to high doses of SSRI's and starts to tolerate them (i.e. the efficacy of the drug deminishes) what pharmocological action should be taken. For example you are as depressed and anxious as before you started SSRI's only now you have added XXXmg of an extremely powerful psycho-analeptic into the mix, which i think we all know is playing havoc with your emotional, psychological and nervous system.
Anyone experiencing withdrawal can testify to the power of these drugs. My concern is the residual effect, after the initial 12 hour effect has passed. If the so-called "half life" of the drug is about 12 hours, what is physical and neuroligical change that has occured that causes the withdrawal symtoms for weeks after? I don't have this answer, neither to i believe any-one does. Be aware.
And lastly withdrawal, are you intending to stop effexor at some stage? My experience after the difficulties of the second attempt, was that no matter how difficult the withdrawal, i would not take 1mg more of effexor. If the withdrawal effects are so dire, what on earth is the drug doing inside my brain.
As an example of how the eficacy of a drug can cause people to ignore the facts. remember a drug that came out in the 50's that was marketed to help nausea in pregnant woman. It was the wonder drug of the day. thalidamide caused severe birth defects on over 10 000 babies.SSRI's will obvioulsy not have the same impact due to their use in depression, anxiety, etc. I can't tell you that SSRI's will cause x, but at the same time you cant tell me it won't. DO the benefits outweigh the negative effects. I don't know. Am i willing to take the risk, in retrospect, absolutely not. Two years ago, i would have given the same answer you gave above.
Posted by justjustine on February 3, 2004, at 14:53:55
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN, posted by on-the-wave on February 3, 2004, at 13:16:53
i know this effexor-hating is uncomfortable for some, but as one who is in week 4 of withdrawal, i feel fully qualified to speak from my experience: stay away from effexor if you can! i have never been so sick as i have been this past month, and the doctors for the most part don't want to believe it's withdrawals from effexor - although they have no other suggestions or ideas for what is wrong. it's incredibly ignorant!
on-the-wave may have some harsh words that are hard to hear, but i have to support what has been said.
this is not a drug that anyone should take with out experienced supervision - and i mean the experience of a doctor who has taken at least one patient through withdrawal successfully. if not, find a new doctor who has, otherwise when you do decide to come off you will not be in the best hands.
Posted by poochi on February 3, 2004, at 15:03:22
In reply to Re: STAY OFF EFFEXOR IF YOU CAN, posted by justjustine on February 3, 2004, at 14:53:55
I agree, STAY AWAY from Effexor !
I am on my 2nd week of with drawl and on my way to the Dr. to get a small dose of it bacause the "zaps" and the dizziness and the wierd sleep things that are going on in me are just WAY to much to handle. I was on 112mg for 1 year, and I must admit, life was good then. It really does help. But, to know then what i know now about TRYING to stop it, well, I 'm not sure if its worth it. People tend to quickly forget the good when things go bad, but for those of you thinking about going on this drug. Be very careful, and DO find a Dr that knows ALOT about this drug. And, please don't think that once you feel better you'll be able to handle the with drawl, IT IS NOT AN EASY thing. Take into concideration what everyone is saying here. It IS a dangerous drug, and VERY VERY addicting.
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