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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by SuzieV on February 9, 2004, at 12:25:18
Hi, I am new to this forum. I am 49 and have been on chlonazepam for over four years for GAD and SAD. I was a new person for the first two years, lost weight got a job and slept for the first time in years. All my unbearable symptoms disappeared. But after two years of working I had a nervous breakdown, (Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Anxiety disorder and depression. I saw a shrink who tried me on Remeron which was awful and I had to quit working because I went into a depression when I went off it. Now I am on 2 mg. of chlonazepam and it has been loosing affect. I need to increase it but toy with the idea of getting off it all together. My doctor wants me to decrease it. Lately I have been taking an extra .05mg, which is the difference of day and night but I am going to be in trouble when I see my doctor. We are moving and have teenagers that are difficult so my stress level has really increased.
Originally my idea was that I would go on it for life, I had discussed this with a previous doctor who left the province. We acknowledged it's addictive quality but hoped it would give me a more normal happy life.
Now I am concerned. I know going off it would be a disaster but I'm not sure what will happen if I continue. I don't really understand why I can't just cautiously increase it when needed. I don't have an addictive personality and don't drink. Does it start to make you have bad side effects at higher doses? Does it eventually not work at all no matter how much you take and make you stupid at the same time. My memory and concentration are not great but never have been and I think that's just because of my GAD.
My sister has had really amazing results with Effexor after she had a major nervous breakdown last year. But she has depression where I have anxiety. But I thought it might help me wean myself off the chlonazepam. But now I am reading bad stories of what happens when you go off Effexor. All other anti-depressants have had intolerable side effects for me anyway.
My brother-in-law, who has Tourettes syndrome is also in the same boat as me. He takes the same amount of Chlonazepam but it isn't working anymore and so his neurologist is giving him an anti-pyschotic and trying to wean him the chlonazepam. This made me consider anti-psychotics, but don't think it's a good idea due to the side effects.
Is there any reason why I can't stay on Chlonazepam for life and increase the dosage as needed? I personally believe it's the best option for me.
Thanks for listening,
SuzieV
Posted by KellyD on February 9, 2004, at 20:02:03
In reply to chlonazepam for life vs. effexor, posted by SuzieV on February 9, 2004, at 12:25:18
There are is a really important question you and your doctor need to try to find an answer to... does you illness manifest more on the anxiety scale or depression or is it a mixed disorder. By your own admission, you seem to be more on the anxiety scale, but you may need to explore this further.
I can only speak to my own experience. I have an anxiety disorder. I have occ. bouts of depression and they usually occur when my anxiety is ill controlled.
Have you had a full physical workup to rule out a physical problem?
I have found clonazepam (Klonopin) to be the only med that works for me, but we are not a "one size fits all" situation. I take a very low dose and have not increased in 3 years of use and at times have required lower dosing, so I remain within a range.
This class of drugs have been around for 40 years and in some individuals are used safely, without pitfalls, and very effective for anxiety states.
There are many different opinions and experience... I'm just glad I have a med and a doc that allowed me to get my life back.
In addition, you may wish to research the use of Klonopin and the role it plays in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome by Paul Cheney, MD.
Good Luck to you.
Posted by action on February 10, 2004, at 1:50:33
In reply to chlonazepam for life vs. effexor, posted by SuzieV on February 9, 2004, at 12:25:18
Hey Suzie,
I found the below thread very informational concerning the long term use of clonazepam (Klonopin).
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20031231/msgs/295342.html
Good Luck
Posted by Suzie V on February 10, 2004, at 14:55:42
In reply to Re: chlonazepam for life vs. effexor, posted by KellyD on February 9, 2004, at 20:02:03
> There are is a really important question you and your doctor need to try to find an answer to... does you illness manifest more on the anxiety scale or depression or is it a mixed disorder.
I know beyond a doubt that my condition is from extreme anxiety that I have had since coming out of the womb. However my shrink tested me for SAD and I scored very high. The Chlonazepam helped me face the CBT but I don't believe that therapy helped.
> I can only speak to my own experience. I have an anxiety disorder. I have occ. bouts of depression and they usually occur when my anxiety is ill controlled.
I am the same. When I get very stressed that's when my depression kicks in, but that's a result of the anxiety, even though it can escatlate to suicidal thoughts. But now I understand that it was this anxiety that impaired my cognitive and social abilities all through life and caused me to switch from one career to another. Now at 49 I am dependant on my husband, although I have a university degree and have worked many years. Let me say that none of those working years were in the least happy ones. I just can't take the stress even with medication. The sad thing is I know I am intelligent, and those who know me intimately can see that, but to strangers I think I come across as less than what I am.
> Have you had a full physical workup to rule out a physical problem?
When I decided to quit my last job two years ago I did. I even had an MRI because my symptoms were mimicking MS. But I am essentially physically healthy, except for the unexplained fatigue and swollen glands, sore throat and coughing. I read somewhere that Chlonazepam can cause couphing. Still it's worth it. Even the memory problems are worth it. Although I still think they are more to do with my age and my anxiety, since when I'm taking the right dose I think more clearly and function normally. It's my fear of increasing my dose even though I need to now that has made me less able to concentrate.
> I have found clonazepam (Klonopin) to be the only med that works for me, but we are not a "one size fits all" situation. I take a very low dose and have not increased in 3 years of use and at times have required lower dosing, so I remain within a range.
Same with me, I actually went from 3mg. to 2mg. and have stayed there for a year, and even reduced it by .05 for a while. Now with my added stress I am up to 2.5 mg., although my doctor doesn't know it yet.
> This class of drugs have been around for 40 years and in some individuals are used safely, without pitfalls, and very effective for anxiety states.
> I'm just glad I have a med and a doc that allowed me to get my life back.
Me too, but I hope my new doctor will understand my need to increase the dose and not make me take another anti-depressant instead.> In addition, you may wish to research the use of Klonopin and the role it plays in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome by Paul Cheney, MD.
Thanks for the support and the suggestion which I will look into. I am lucky I have a husband to support me financially as disability has turned me down. At my age I would rather not go back to work with my problems. It will ultimately end in disaster as it always has.
> Good Luck to you.
And to you, it's very comforting to know there are others with similar problems, although I wouldn't wish them on anyone.
SuzieV
Posted by Suzie V on February 10, 2004, at 15:25:18
In reply to Re: chlonazepam for life vs. effexor » SuzieV, posted by action on February 10, 2004, at 1:50:33
Thanks for the link. It really helped. I am coming to the conclusion that my insincts are right. No-one knows themselves better than themselves. Anti-depressants are not for me and although I have been talked into them and scared into them, they have always made me much worse. I feel more relaxed just knowing that many other users feel the same, that nothing works better than the Chlonazepam, so it makes sense to stick to it. If my doctor doesn't agree than I hope I will find one I can work with.
> I found the below thread very informational concerning the long term use of clonazepam (Klonopin).
Just want to add that at 49, I have a 19 and a 16 year old who are both intellectually gifted, but do not understand my condition and think I am stupid because I have trouble concentrating and remembering. Teenagers aren't very empathic and they think it's my fault for taking the drugs. They just don't get what I was like when I was young like them. I couldn't concentrate back then either or remember or come up with certain words quickly, way before I ever took a drug other that aspirin. It scared me and made my anxiety worse. I guess it's a cyclical thing. I was very unhappy. I always knew I was different but couldn't understand what it was about me.
Now I know I am not stupid, and none of this is my fault, but it still hurts when your own children don't respect you because you have anxiety problems. Living with teenagers lately, (and moving), is stressing me out and depression is creeping in. But I know they will mature one day and hope they will understand me and forgive me for being what my daughter called me yesterday, "a pyscho". She was refering to the moody depressed person I was before I took chlonazepam.
Thanks again.
SuzieV> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20031231/msgs/295342.html
>
> Good Luck
Posted by KellyD on February 10, 2004, at 15:36:44
In reply to Re: chlonazepam for life vs. effexor » KellyD, posted by Suzie V on February 10, 2004, at 14:55:42
I am very glad you wrote back. I do understand alot of your concerns and alot about your life. I have found Klonopin has been really good for me and I have avoided the problems that can happen. I have also found some complimentary suppliments that have helped me, too. I'm a little (not by much) younger than you but I think some of my issues are hormonal based. I, too, worked more and was very "successful and driven". I do not work as often now, but that has been good for me.....other than the loss of some of the way I identified myself. I'm fortunate to have a supportive husband and daughter. I am very lucky.
Please continue to advocate for what feels right for you. I do truly hope you find peace and comfort and a big dose of joy. I have to believe they are attainable goals.
Posted by terrics on February 12, 2004, at 16:05:03
In reply to chlonazepam for life vs. effexor, posted by SuzieV on February 9, 2004, at 12:25:18
Hi Susie, I am on both effexor and klonopin. One of the uses of effexor is for anxiety. Maybe you can try the 2 together. I refuse to worry now about what may happen down the line if I come off the effexor. terrics
Posted by Suzie V on February 12, 2004, at 20:03:01
In reply to Re: chlonazepam for life vs. effexor » SuzieV, posted by terrics on February 12, 2004, at 16:05:03
Hi terrics, I have thought about using the effexor to get off the klonopin but since the klonopin doesn't work so well these days taking both may be an option. I've heard effexor doesn't work as well for anxiety but does help, so I assume I would have to take both. But I worry terribly what will happen to me if I have to go off either and since I'm almost fifty what effect will it have on me when I'm older and for the longterm. I'm already pretty spacey sometimes. I will see how I feel after we have moved, that alone is totally stressing me out. You don't want to hear the details but it's a mess. I imagine if the effexor has the same effect on me as it does on my sister, who has major depression, then it would be great. But I can't help but fear anti-depressants because of problems I have had with them in the past. Thanks for the suggestion though. I may try it.
SuzieV
> Hi Susie, I am on both effexor and klonopin. One of the uses of effexor is for anxiety. Maybe you can try the 2 together. I refuse to worry now about what may happen down the line if I come off the effexor. terrics
Posted by terrics on February 13, 2004, at 15:54:53
In reply to Re: chlonazepam for life vs. effexor » terrics, posted by Suzie V on February 12, 2004, at 20:03:01
I hope everything works out ok. Maybe you WILL feel better after moving. It is ok to 'talk' about it. Maybe on the psychobabble psychology board. I'll 'listen'. ps I am 53 ugh. terrics
Posted by Suzie V on February 13, 2004, at 16:34:31
In reply to Re: chlonazepam for life vs. effexor » Suzie V, posted by terrics on February 13, 2004, at 15:54:53
Hi Terrics
Aging sucks doesn't it?
Do you mind if I ask how long you've been on the klonopin and then the effexor. Did the klonopin stop working and how do you feel now with both of them. Are you able to work? Do you find any side effects from either med. I can't believe how effexor helped my sister. She went from insane to better than normal. I hope it lasts for her. But I always react differently than her to the antidepressants. And I have never been as depressed as her, just way more anxious. Klonopin helped me unbelievably for a few years, its so disheartening now that I feel so awful again.
Hope you don't mind all the questions but I am really interested in how people are affected. I'll take a look at the psychobabble psychology board but for now I am just interested in the meds.
Thanks,
SuzieV
> I hope everything works out ok. Maybe you WILL feel better after moving. It is ok to 'talk' about it. Maybe on the psychobabble psychology board. I'll 'listen'. ps I am 53 ugh. terrics
Posted by terrics on February 14, 2004, at 18:49:49
In reply to Re: chlonazepam for life vs. effexor » terrics, posted by Suzie V on February 13, 2004, at 16:34:31
Hi Suzie, Yes, aging sucks. I think I'll start pretending to be 40. lol I'll just give you a quick rundown on my meds. I am sure it will bore you. effexor xr, klonopin, lithium, wellbutrin sr. Also, inderal for the tremors from the lithium. One thing I found interesting is how well the wellbutrin works with the klonopin. This combo seems to make it easier for me to work. We are not all the same though. The klonopin has never 'stopped working' for me and I do not have to increase the dose. Good luck in your quest for the right meds. They are out there, but you need a good pdoc. ps Can you work? terrics
Posted by bristol on February 15, 2004, at 16:23:37
In reply to chlonazepam for life vs. effexor, posted by SuzieV on February 9, 2004, at 12:25:18
Hi - In answer to your question about whether or not you should stay on Clonazepam for life..i"ll share my story with you. I've been on Klonipin for three years now mostly staying between 1-2 mg depending on what I needed for sleep. The last year has been the toughest. Klonipin was the stable drug while I was put through the gamet of Depakote, Trilyptal, Topomax and Effexor. I'm off everything now but Klonipin and I'm realizing that by increasing to 2.5Mg, I've increased several side effects. I did research today and this is what i found..it confirms my own problems that I've been having with nightmares, hostility, anger, inability to keep stress levels in check and respiratory problems: here they are: Most of the adverse effects associated with clonazepam therapy are CNS-related and
dose-dependent including: headache, drowsiness, ataxia3 , dizziness, confusion,
depression, slurred speech, syncope4 , lightheadedness, fatigue, tremors, and
vertigo.Occasionally, paradoxical CNS stimulation can occur, particularly in psychiatric patients and hyperactive children.
Symptoms of paradoxical CNS stimulation include hostility, nightmares, talkativeness, excitement, mania, tremulousness, sleep disturbances, increased muscle spasticity, acute rage reactions, anxiety, restlessness, euphoria, and hyperflexia.
Benzodiazepine therapy should be discontinued if any of the signs of paradoxical CNS excitement occur.
<http://www.hsc.missouri.edu/htmls/indexes/products/marking/k.html>;Hi, I am new to this forum. I am 49 and have been on chlonazepam for over four years for GAD and SAD. I was a new person for the first two years, lost weight got a job and slept for the first time in years. All my unbearable symptoms disappeared. But after two years of working I had a nervous breakdown, (Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Anxiety disorder and depression. I saw a shrink who tried me on Remeron which was awful and I had to quit working because I went into a depression when I went off it. Now I am on 2 mg. of chlonazepam and it has been loosing affect. I need to increase it but toy with the idea of getting off it all together. My doctor wants me to decrease it. Lately I have been taking an extra .05mg, which is the difference of day and night but I am going to be in trouble when I see my doctor. We are moving and have teenagers that are difficult so my stress level has really increased.
> Originally my idea was that I would go on it for life, I had discussed this with a previous doctor who left the province. We acknowledged it's addictive quality but hoped it would give me a more normal happy life.
> Now I am concerned. I know going off it would be a disaster but I'm not sure what will happen if I continue. I don't really understand why I can't just cautiously increase it when needed. I don't have an addictive personality and don't drink. Does it start to make you have bad side effects at higher doses? Does it eventually not work at all no matter how much you take and make you stupid at the same time. My memory and concentration are not great but never have been and I think that's just because of my GAD.
> My sister has had really amazing results with Effexor after she had a major nervous breakdown last year. But she has depression where I have anxiety. But I thought it might help me wean myself off the chlonazepam. But now I am reading bad stories of what happens when you go off Effexor. All other anti-depressants have had intolerable side effects for me anyway.
> My brother-in-law, who has Tourettes syndrome is also in the same boat as me. He takes the same amount of Chlonazepam but it isn't working anymore and so his neurologist is giving him an anti-pyschotic and trying to wean him the chlonazepam. This made me consider anti-psychotics, but don't think it's a good idea due to the side effects.
> Is there any reason why I can't stay on Chlonazepam for life and increase the dosage as needed? I personally believe it's the best option for me.
> Thanks for listening,
> SuzieV
Posted by jimmygold70 on February 17, 2004, at 18:13:36
In reply to chlonazepam for life vs. effexor, posted by SuzieV on February 9, 2004, at 12:25:18
There is nothing bad with clonazepam for itself, but the usual strategy is to give Effexor at a high dose (150-225mg). Effects takes up to 3 months to kick in (after a long research and personal experience - you can feel nothing for 2MO and after 2 wks it kicks in!!!)
After that, you can start taking clonazepam down very slowly, like 0.1mg every two weeks. If you can't bear it - stay on clonazepam for good. It's fine. You are dependent on it, not addicted.
Jimmy
> Hi, I am new to this forum. I am 49 and have been on chlonazepam for over four years for GAD and SAD. I was a new person for the first two years, lost weight got a job and slept for the first time in years. All my unbearable symptoms disappeared. But after two years of working I had a nervous breakdown, (Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Anxiety disorder and depression. I saw a shrink who tried me on Remeron which was awful and I had to quit working because I went into a depression when I went off it. Now I am on 2 mg. of chlonazepam and it has been loosing affect. I need to increase it but toy with the idea of getting off it all together. My doctor wants me to decrease it. Lately I have been taking an extra .05mg, which is the difference of day and night but I am going to be in trouble when I see my doctor. We are moving and have teenagers that are difficult so my stress level has really increased.
> Originally my idea was that I would go on it for life, I had discussed this with a previous doctor who left the province. We acknowledged it's addictive quality but hoped it would give me a more normal happy life.
> Now I am concerned. I know going off it would be a disaster but I'm not sure what will happen if I continue. I don't really understand why I can't just cautiously increase it when needed. I don't have an addictive personality and don't drink. Does it start to make you have bad side effects at higher doses? Does it eventually not work at all no matter how much you take and make you stupid at the same time. My memory and concentration are not great but never have been and I think that's just because of my GAD.
> My sister has had really amazing results with Effexor after she had a major nervous breakdown last year. But she has depression where I have anxiety. But I thought it might help me wean myself off the chlonazepam. But now I am reading bad stories of what happens when you go off Effexor. All other anti-depressants have had intolerable side effects for me anyway.
> My brother-in-law, who has Tourettes syndrome is also in the same boat as me. He takes the same amount of Chlonazepam but it isn't working anymore and so his neurologist is giving him an anti-pyschotic and trying to wean him the chlonazepam. This made me consider anti-psychotics, but don't think it's a good idea due to the side effects.
> Is there any reason why I can't stay on Chlonazepam for life and increase the dosage as needed? I personally believe it's the best option for me.
> Thanks for listening,
> SuzieV> Hi, I am new to this forum. I am 49 and have been on chlonazepam for over four years for GAD and SAD. I was a new person for the first two years, lost weight got a job and slept for the first time in years. All my unbearable symptoms disappeared. But after two years of working I had a nervous breakdown, (Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Anxiety disorder and depression. I saw a shrink who tried me on Remeron which was awful and I had to quit working because I went into a depression when I went off it. Now I am on 2 mg. of chlonazepam and it has been loosing affect. I need to increase it but toy with the idea of getting off it all together. My doctor wants me to decrease it. Lately I have been taking an extra .05mg, which is the difference of day and night but I am going to be in trouble when I see my doctor. We are moving and have teenagers that are difficult so my stress level has really increased.
> Originally my idea was that I would go on it for life, I had discussed this with a previous doctor who left the province. We acknowledged it's addictive quality but hoped it would give me a more normal happy life.
> Now I am concerned. I know going off it would be a disaster but I'm not sure what will happen if I continue. I don't really understand why I can't just cautiously increase it when needed. I don't have an addictive personality and don't drink. Does it start to make you have bad side effects at higher doses? Does it eventually not work at all no matter how much you take and make you stupid at the same time. My memory and concentration are not great but never have been and I think that's just because of my GAD.
> My sister has had really amazing results with Effexor after she had a major nervous breakdown last year. But she has depression where I have anxiety. But I thought it might help me wean myself off the chlonazepam. But now I am reading bad stories of what happens when you go off Effexor. All other anti-depressants have had intolerable side effects for me anyway.
> My brother-in-law, who has Tourettes syndrome is also in the same boat as me. He takes the same amount of Chlonazepam but it isn't working anymore and so his neurologist is giving him an anti-pyschotic and trying to wean him the chlonazepam. This made me consider anti-psychotics, but don't think it's a good idea due to the side effects.
> Is there any reason why I can't stay on Chlonazepam for life and increase the dosage as needed? I personally believe it's the best option for me.
> Thanks for listening,
> SuzieV
This is the end of the thread.
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