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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 27. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Cseagraves on April 11, 2009, at 13:32:31
Hi all!
I have been reading so much on other sites regarding the old Nardil vs. the new Nardil. People have said it worked wonderfully before 2003 and now it is not in the least as effective and people are having awful side effects.
Apparently so many groups of people have tried to contact Pfizer in regards to the new formulation, but to no avail. The new formulation has caused alot of health problems for alot of people.
Was wondering who on here has been taking the newer version and how it has worked for them. Have also read that there might be a difference in the Cananadian and USA version. People are also saying that they are getting bad batches with certain lot numbers.
I just need something to work for extreme anxieties. I am not depressed. Ssris and other meds do not work and was hoping Nardil might be the answer.
I have tried everything other med possible. Just had a severe allergic reaction to Zoloft as I do with all ssris. I do not think seratonin is the problem with me. I just have anxieties. I am not depressed. Benzos do not work long enough. Snri's scare me and reviews on them are not very positive. I have severe reactions to antipsychotics and TCA's do not work because my anxieties are pretty extreme.
Parnate doesn't seems like a good choice and I cannot find alot of positive reviews on Ensam. Marplan, not enough information on and not sure what it targets exactly. (depression or anxiety)
Any opinions would be appreciated.
Thanks!
Courtney
Posted by SLS on April 11, 2009, at 13:49:19
In reply to New version of Nardil, posted by Cseagraves on April 11, 2009, at 13:32:31
I sort of like the idea of combining Nardil + Klonopin for extreme generalized anxiety disorder (GAD) or social anxiety disorder (SAD). You can also try adding Neurontin. These drugs sometimes help with phobias and panic attacks as well.
- Scott
Posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 14:19:36
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by SLS on April 11, 2009, at 13:49:19
> I sort of like the idea of combining Nardil + Klonopin for extreme generalized anxiety disorder (GAD) or social anxiety disorder (SAD). You can also try adding Neurontin. These drugs sometimes help with phobias and panic attacks as well.
>
>
> - ScottTell you what,not speaking in terms of daily use here,however KLONOPIN PLUS GABPENTIN togther in high doses compliment each other and i find are great for any maniac phases people sometimes come across,first it puts you down,and then upon wakening you feel much much better,also for me this combo when needed also stimulates my parnate to work better.
For maniac phases i recomend,and im not a doc of course just personaly,a 800 mg tab of gabpentin and a 1 mg tab of klonopin.For whatever reason gabpentin capsules do not help me,i love the 800 tabs because you can literaly BITE a partial amount off when you become familiar with it and partial amounts also help a lot at times.
Why the capsules dont help me at all i dont know.
Posted by SLS on April 11, 2009, at 17:12:34
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 14:19:36
> Tell you what,not speaking in terms of daily use here,however KLONOPIN PLUS GABPENTIN togther in high doses compliment each other and i find are great for any maniac phases people sometimes come across,first it puts you down,and then upon wakening you feel much much better,also for me this combo when needed also stimulates my parnate to work better.
Very interesting observations. Thanks.
- Scott
Posted by myco on April 11, 2009, at 21:04:15
In reply to New version of Nardil, posted by Cseagraves on April 11, 2009, at 13:32:31
Hun dont get lost in the debate of old versus new. The sites you are reading about supposed "health problems" are set up be people using the old nardil who are experiencing side effects due to the change in the inert ingredients in the pills. It isnt health problems in actual fact, it's withdrawal and the associated issues with that.
When you read that debate on those sites....its bitterness and confusion and frustration your reading. Bottom line is nardil is still here and people still have great results with it regardless of a change. Many of us dont know the old nardil and cant say. New works for me fine
> Hi all!
>
> I have been reading so much on other sites regarding the old Nardil vs. the new Nardil. People have said it worked wonderfully before 2003 and now it is not in the least as effective and people are having awful side effects.
>
> Apparently so many groups of people have tried to contact Pfizer in regards to the new formulation, but to no avail. The new formulation has caused alot of health problems for alot of people.
>
> Was wondering who on here has been taking the newer version and how it has worked for them. Have also read that there might be a difference in the Cananadian and USA version. People are also saying that they are getting bad batches with certain lot numbers.
>
> I just need something to work for extreme anxieties. I am not depressed. Ssris and other meds do not work and was hoping Nardil might be the answer.
>
> I have tried everything other med possible. Just had a severe allergic reaction to Zoloft as I do with all ssris. I do not think seratonin is the problem with me. I just have anxieties. I am not depressed. Benzos do not work long enough. Snri's scare me and reviews on them are not very positive. I have severe reactions to antipsychotics and TCA's do not work because my anxieties are pretty extreme.
>
> Parnate doesn't seems like a good choice and I cannot find alot of positive reviews on Ensam. Marplan, not enough information on and not sure what it targets exactly. (depression or anxiety)
>
> Any opinions would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks!
> Courtney
Posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 23:32:03
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil » Cseagraves, posted by myco on April 11, 2009, at 21:04:15
Hmm the nardil site has thousands of users,some i read who were users for 20 plus years with no problems who due to the change literaly had to get off of the med,so i would not speak so firm on that issue.
Yess its still a great med for people,but that doesent mean the tons of veterans who swear it isnt the same hold no credit,thats your opinion and you seem to present it as a fact in your post.
Posted by myco on April 11, 2009, at 23:42:18
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 23:32:03
Fact: phenelzine is phenelzine
Fact: inert ingredients are different in old vs new
Fact: some old users like the new
Fact: those sites represent the angry users. rarely do I see logical thinking go from thought to thought thereThose are the zzziggy. now run along son
> Hmm the nardil site has thousands of users,some i read who were users for 20 plus years with no problems who due to the change literaly had to get off of the med,so i would not speak so firm on that issue.
>
> Yess its still a great med for people,but that doesent mean the tons of veterans who swear it isnt the same hold no credit,thats your opinion and you seem to present it as a fact in your post.
Posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 23:51:42
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil » shasling, posted by myco on April 11, 2009, at 23:42:18
Sure well all just write off a entire site of users because YOU say so.
http://www.anxietyhelp.org/treatment/medication/nardil.html
Anyone looking to find about as many users with new nardil problems about the same amount of posters currently on this page visit the link above.
P.S Run along son,lol nah i like it here,sorry you have a problem with opinions that differ from yours,and while your at it keep the cyber insults to yourself please,they are long played out.
Posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 0:27:43
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 23:51:42
When you begin to feed into discouragement for someone seeking supportive info on a med that may make a huge difference to them you deserve a bollocking in the least
> Sure well all just write off a entire site of users because YOU say so.
>
> http://www.anxietyhelp.org/treatment/medication/nardil.html
>
> Anyone looking to find about as many users with new nardil problems about the same amount of posters currently on this page visit the link above.
>
> P.S Run along son,lol nah i like it here,sorry you have a problem with opinions that differ from yours,and while your at it keep the cyber insults to yourself please,they are long played out.
Posted by Phillipa on April 12, 2009, at 0:28:27
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 23:51:42
I feel that if someone started on the old they could notice a differnce on the new based upon what I've read. But for someone just starting I feel it wouldn't matter. Love Phillipa just my opinion.
Posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 0:29:44
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by Phillipa on April 12, 2009, at 0:28:27
Mooo-ahhh-sss (a wet one for ya) luv ya Jan. common sense :o)
> I feel that if someone started on the old they could notice a differnce on the new based upon what I've read. But for someone just starting I feel it wouldn't matter. Love Phillipa just my opinion.
Posted by mav27 on April 12, 2009, at 4:22:05
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 11, 2009, at 23:51:42
yeah and we will just aggree that we never went to the moon because an entire site says so
http://www.ufos-aliens.co.uk/cosmicapollo.htmlPhenelzine is phenelzine, it still does the exact same thing in the brain regardless of the inert ingerdiants that get destroyed in the stomach.
> Sure well all just write off a entire site of users because YOU say so.
>
> http://www.anxietyhelp.org/treatment/medication/nardil.html
>
> Anyone looking to find about as many users with new nardil problems about the same amount of posters currently on this page visit the link above.
>
> P.S Run along son,lol nah i like it here,sorry you have a problem with opinions that differ from yours,and while your at it keep the cyber insults to yourself please,they are long played out.
Posted by SLS on April 12, 2009, at 6:51:25
In reply to New version of Nardil, posted by Cseagraves on April 11, 2009, at 13:32:31
Hi.
You can see that there is much dissension among Nardil users past and present whether or not there is a *clinical* difference between the old versus new Nardil. I made the change from old to new while in the middle of Nardil therapy. I found no difference between the two regarding efficacy or side effects. However, I feel sure that there are people who do better on brand name versus generic preperations for numerous drugs, some of them being psychotropics. In my doctor's experience, the name brand is superior for preparations of paroxetine and lamotrigine to name a few.
Different is different. The "inert" ingredients are different. So might be the manufacturing process. One might expect that some generics have different clinical properties when compared to the name brand. I imagine that some complaints are due to a sort of self-fulfilling placebo-type response to the change.
Anyway, it sounds plausible that the binders and exipients that vary from one preperation to the other produce differences in bioavailability. However, I have absolutely no factual proof of such a thing.
If, after the change from old to new, I began to relapse, I would have petitioned my doctor to simply raise the dosage. It might be simplistic and wishful thinking, but I should hope that others might have tried this with good effect.
Seeing is believing. Not seeing provides a rational tendency to disbelief. The new vs old Nardil debate has become quite passionate. I personally have not seen anyone at PB demonstrate a different clinical response to one prepatation versus the other upon change-over.
Let us keep an open mind, just in case no scientific proof comes our way any time soon.
- Scott
Posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 11:28:22
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil » shasling, posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 0:27:43
No one is feeding into anything,parnate for example was changed from its initial ingrediets to where the coating is now dry opposed to goldshiels whos parnate still has a smoother sweeter coating.
I posted a site,but i have common sense to be able to respect both views.Ive used liquid deprenyl as well and found that to be effective where as i did not find the tabs to be.
If thats your view on nardil then thats fine,and like you said its available so hold your on balls as they seem bigger then your head,im not debating on the effectivness of the med,just providing info,its when one gets their panties in a bunch over a opposite view to me only makes me wonder and i usualy pass that persons view as obsessive.
Again im asking you to keep your insults to yourself.
Posted by Zana on April 12, 2009, at 15:21:34
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 11:28:22
Whoa. What's with all the anger? Doesn't feel like the right atmosphere for babble. I'm prescribing chill pills all around.
Zana
Posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 15:26:33
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by Zana on April 12, 2009, at 15:21:34
I'm totally relaxed hun....i just dont like discouragement posted when support and encouragement should be used. To post antagonism to support is, in a way itself, "uncivil"...but im not the one to make that judgement. He/she thinks I stand against opposing opinions....this is a matter of choice though not opinion. fact is not opinion...fact is nardil works, is still rx'd and still used with success. No anger from me Zana...i'm always calm but I may speak with passion in my posts. He/she thinks their insulted lol ok. takes all kinds doesnt it.
> Whoa. What's with all the anger? Doesn't feel like the right atmosphere for babble. I'm prescribing chill pills all around.
>
> Zana
>
Posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 15:40:06
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil » Zana, posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 15:26:33
Im a he www.myspace.com/redhook23 and your not posting fact,but opinion.Fact is veteran users went to extremes such as bringing civil suits to pzifer,so your saying numerous users who find issues with the reformulation are all just i,i think your word was ziggy?
Everything i post is supportive,but dont insult me then say you dident.
Nardil is around,so is parnate,my posts show im one of the biggest advocates of maoi use,and thats a fact.Sharing information is not uncivil.
Posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 16:38:40
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 15:40:06
*yawns
> Im a he www.myspace.com/redhook23 and your not posting fact,but opinion.Fact is veteran users went to extremes such as bringing civil suits to pzifer,so your saying numerous users who find issues with the reformulation are all just i,i think your word was ziggy?
>
> Everything i post is supportive,but dont insult me then say you dident.
>
> Nardil is around,so is parnate,my posts show im one of the biggest advocates of maoi use,and thats a fact.Sharing information is not uncivil.
Posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 17:07:18
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 16:38:40
My mistake sorry you are the authority on nardil,thanks i will ignore that site now that you have graced me with your detailed info on nardil.Now cease you obsession with me.
Posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 17:34:31
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 17:07:18
lol uh huh...come on, snowball, lets go
> My mistake sorry you are the authority on nardil,thanks i will ignore that site now that you have graced me with your detailed info on nardil.Now cease you obsession with me.
Posted by mav27 on April 12, 2009, at 20:06:17
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 15:40:06
> Im a he www.myspace.com/redhook23 and your not posting fact,but opinion.Fact is veteran users went to extremes such as bringing civil suits to pzifer,
>Ameericans i bet.
Posted by myco on April 12, 2009, at 20:09:03
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil » shasling, posted by mav27 on April 12, 2009, at 20:06:17
lol watch out Mav...he'll yell 'insult' at you
> > Im a he www.myspace.com/redhook23 and your not posting fact,but opinion.Fact is veteran users went to extremes such as bringing civil suits to pzifer,
> >
>
> Ameericans i bet.
Posted by Phillipa on April 12, 2009, at 20:12:01
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil, posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 15:40:06
Didn't know you changed your posting name. Isn't using another poster's name uncivil? Against site guidelines? Just asking. Phillipa
Posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 21:12:04
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil » shasling, posted by Phillipa on April 12, 2009, at 20:12:01
> Didn't know you changed your posting name. Isn't using another poster's name uncivil? Against site guidelines? Just asking. Phillipa
I dont know,next time you email me as you do over and over again we can discuss it.
Since i never actualy emailed you,perhaps its a good idea you forget my email,i really dont need someone emailing me having a emotional meltdown because babble was down a day.
Posted by shasling on April 12, 2009, at 21:14:19
In reply to Re: New version of Nardil » shasling, posted by mav27 on April 12, 2009, at 20:06:17
> > Im a he www.myspace.com/redhook23 and your not posting fact,but opinion.Fact is veteran users went to extremes such as bringing civil suits to pzifer,
> >
>
> Ameericans i bet.Actualy it is AMERICANS not ameericans.
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