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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by rnny on February 2, 2010, at 0:50:47
My pdoc suggested it for me "maybe" if things get much worse depression wise. would like to get any feedback.
Posted by Phillipa on February 2, 2010, at 12:32:26
In reply to anyone had ECT?, posted by rnny on February 2, 2010, at 0:50:47
Recently there have been quite a few threads on ECT. I bet if you scroll up the page one is still there. Phillipa
Posted by bleauberry on February 3, 2010, at 20:15:56
In reply to anyone had ECT?, posted by rnny on February 2, 2010, at 0:50:47
You can search the psychobabble archives. There have been numerous threads on ECT. In those threads you'll get a good feel for real-world experiences of real people like you who went through ECT.
In general nonscientific terms, I would guess the comments here from ECT survivors are about 60% negative and 40% positive. The negative ones are usually VERY negative...as in it didn't work at all, worked a little bit, or worked for only a short time, with severe permanent memory loss and cognitive decline. The positive ones are not robust. That is, when it worked, it saved them from a seemingly bottomless pit, but didn't last very long and was not the magic thing that puts an end to the whole battle.
In clinical studies nearly everyone who goes through ECT requires medication after ECT, whether it worked or not.
I personally believe the statistics on the efficacy of ECT are very over-hyped. I think one of the reasons for that is because for all the people who had negative experiences, they are not followed post-ECT. They fade away, the doctors never hear from them again, never know what happened, and record in their records that something that does not indicate it failed. Their stories are not heard. Also, patients are not followed longterm. So even someone who did have a robust good response to ECT, well, we don't ahve any record of how they were 6 months later. All the records showed are "remission" at the time of discharge. On the flip side, articles and documentaries are written on the positive ones.
Clinical studies show an extremely high relapse rate post-ECT within weeks to a couple or several months.
My best way I can describe ECT is that it closes a bad chapter and opens a new fresh one. Whether the new one is any better than the old one or not is unknown, but at least it is a fresh start. I am kind of glad to have lost all those memories of the months leading up to ECT. Of course, I lost a bunch of memories after ECT as well as random chunks throughout my entire lifespan as well.
Before anyone tries ECT, I think these prerequisites need to have been done first. Without having done these things, I do not believe anyone has any business considering ECT.
1. Parnate.
2. Nardil.
3. Zoloft+Nortriptyline
4. Lexapro+Abilify or Risperdal
5. Savella, with possible addition of Risperdal.
6. Ritalin with any SSRI.
7. One final short trial before ECT...Tramadol.
Posted by Bob on February 3, 2010, at 23:32:02
In reply to Re: anyone had ECT?, posted by bleauberry on February 3, 2010, at 20:15:56
> You can search the psychobabble archives. There have been numerous threads on ECT. In those threads you'll get a good feel for real-world experiences of real people like you who went through ECT.
>
> In general nonscientific terms, I would guess the comments here from ECT survivors are about 60% negative and 40% positive. The negative ones are usually VERY negative...as in it didn't work at all, worked a little bit, or worked for only a short time, with severe permanent memory loss and cognitive decline. The positive ones are not robust. That is, when it worked, it saved them from a seemingly bottomless pit, but didn't last very long and was not the magic thing that puts an end to the whole battle.
>
> In clinical studies nearly everyone who goes through ECT requires medication after ECT, whether it worked or not.
>
> I personally believe the statistics on the efficacy of ECT are very over-hyped. I think one of the reasons for that is because for all the people who had negative experiences, they are not followed post-ECT. They fade away, the doctors never hear from them again, never know what happened, and record in their records that something that does not indicate it failed. Their stories are not heard. Also, patients are not followed longterm. So even someone who did have a robust good response to ECT, well, we don't ahve any record of how they were 6 months later. All the records showed are "remission" at the time of discharge. On the flip side, articles and documentaries are written on the positive ones.
>
> Clinical studies show an extremely high relapse rate post-ECT within weeks to a couple or several months.
>
> My best way I can describe ECT is that it closes a bad chapter and opens a new fresh one. Whether the new one is any better than the old one or not is unknown, but at least it is a fresh start. I am kind of glad to have lost all those memories of the months leading up to ECT. Of course, I lost a bunch of memories after ECT as well as random chunks throughout my entire lifespan as well.
>
> Before anyone tries ECT, I think these prerequisites need to have been done first. Without having done these things, I do not believe anyone has any business considering ECT.
> 1. Parnate.
> 2. Nardil.
> 3. Zoloft+Nortriptyline
> 4. Lexapro+Abilify or Risperdal
> 5. Savella, with possible addition of Risperdal.
> 6. Ritalin with any SSRI.
> 7. One final short trial before ECT...Tramadol.
>
>Excellent post, Bleauberry. I think there is some good advice there, and having gone through ECT, I share many of your thoughts. I too feel that ECT has become overrated for just the reasons you stated. Patients are not followed after treatment and there is a natural bias against negative results being studied or published, whether it be ECT or meds.
Posted by alchemy on February 4, 2010, at 20:23:56
In reply to anyone had ECT?, posted by rnny on February 2, 2010, at 0:50:47
I've posted before. Positive for me with only 6 treatments. Took me from say a -20 depression to a 0 and then my relapse was about a -6.
Posted by gibbons482 on February 5, 2010, at 12:09:50
In reply to anyone had ECT?, posted by rnny on February 2, 2010, at 0:50:47
I've had ECT. It helped pull me out of a suicidal depression. But like others have said it's not the end all--you still have to take meds or have maintenance ECT. For me the positive effects lasted six months before I Started another series of ECT and continued on maintenance.
Posted by Cherry Carver on February 10, 2010, at 17:41:37
In reply to anyone had ECT?, posted by rnny on February 2, 2010, at 0:50:47
During hospitalization in 1997 I was threatened with it. That's as close as I ever got. Didn't exactly make me rabid to try it after that, since it was suggested not as a beneficial treatment but as a punishment for not responding well to the meds they gave me.
> My pdoc suggested it for me "maybe" if things get much worse depression wise. would like to get any feedback.
Posted by tonyz on February 16, 2010, at 19:26:30
In reply to Re: anyone had ECT? » rnny, posted by Cherry Carver on February 10, 2010, at 17:41:37
There was an interesting article posted by a physician about ECT. He pointed out that it ruptures the blood brain barrier. There is trans cranial magnetic stimulation which sounds less intrusive - more popular in Canada recently approved in the US. There is also vaginal nerve stimulation.
I don't like taking drugs for my depression but unfortunately I haven't found an alternative. Given the three choices identified above if I had to pick one I would probably go with transcranial magnetic stimulation, but I don't know very much about any of these options.
Like others have said it is probably best to explore other drug therapies for resorting to ECT.
If you want the article I mentioned - reply to this post and I'll see if I can dig it up.
Good luck, hang in there. My doc had suggested ECT for me several years ago - that is when I switched docs. Things weren't working out and I had to go in the hospital but I got better with drug therapy.
This is the end of the thread.
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