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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
I'm fairly certain that the psychostimulants enhance the performance of any musician. I'm curious how antidepressants, benzodiazepines, anticonvulsants Lithium and antipsychotics effect an artist. My guess is its impossible to perform while on a mood stabilizer or antipsychotic. I hope I'm wrong.
Posted by Brainbeard on October 5, 2010, at 6:52:06
In reply to any Musicians on meds?, posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
> I'm fairly certain that the psychostimulants enhance the performance of any musician. I'm curious how antidepressants, benzodiazepines, anticonvulsants Lithium and antipsychotics effect an artist. My guess is its impossible to perform while on a mood stabilizer or antipsychotic. I hope I'm wrong.
Impossible to perform? Impossible to be creative, perhaps. Performing shouldn't be a problem. Maybe if short-term memory gets severely impaired.
Paxil (SSRI) only fostered my creative process, by making me hypomanic. Benzodiazepines could play a promoting role similar to booze for creativity, and likewise decrease the quality of performance. Remembering may become harder on benzo's. Gabapentin (Neurontin) didn't affect me musically. Low dose Risperdal only helped.
Psychostimulants are actually known to mute creativity in the longer run.
Posted by emme on October 5, 2010, at 7:16:06
In reply to any Musicians on meds?, posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
> I'm fairly certain that the psychostimulants enhance the performance of any musician. I'm curious how antidepressants, benzodiazepines, anticonvulsants Lithium and antipsychotics effect an artist. My guess is its impossible to perform while on a mood stabilizer or antipsychotic. I hope I'm wrong.
Hi. Some meds made it very difficult for me to read sheet music or play. Keppra (an anticonvulsant) was the worst. My brain just couldn't process the info and put it all together.
That's not as much of a problem on my current meds (Lamictal and Abilify). Both of them seem to be better than some of the other drugs for me for cognitive impairment as long as my doses stay low. I don't perform these days, but I think I could on this combo. So no, I don't think it's a given that a mood stabilizer or antipsychotic will make you unable to perform. You just might have to try them and see which meds work out the best in that regard.
Good luck. It's bad enough that we have to contend with depression or bipolar disorder without have to lose music.
emme
Posted by Phillipa on October 5, 2010, at 12:17:07
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds? » former poster, posted by emme on October 5, 2010, at 7:16:06
Just curious why would a med affect a musician an differently than any other profession? I have noticed through reading books and watching TV shows that it seems a number of actors, actresses and performers are bipolar. I know my ex deceased father in law developed a dynasty before his bipolar became full blown. It seems that bipolar Persons are extremly gifted and intelligent. I'm not bipolar so I'm not downing others as then downing myself also. Hope this makes sense. Wow 40 years of low dose benzos and I still remember everything. Phillipa
Posted by Bob12 on October 5, 2010, at 15:58:00
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds?, posted by Phillipa on October 5, 2010, at 12:17:07
I have recorded 3 albums on Zyprexa.
I have started a support group online for musicians "on meds:"http://www.dailystrength.org/groups/musicians
any musicians on this board are welcome to join to share and receive comments on their work.
Bob12
Posted by linkadge on October 5, 2010, at 20:09:29
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds?, posted by Bob12 on October 5, 2010, at 15:58:00
Actually, I could play the piano fine on lithium. It may have improved some aspects of performance.
Anything that blocks 5-ht2a makes it pretty nasty for me to play piano.
For me, ritalin makes my playing more linear and less frilly. It can help me learn whats infront of me better, but I find less creativity and ability to improvise.
SSRI's seem to improve the ability to improvise on a well learned tune. I think this fits (with some degree) for the ability of dopamine to facilitate the integration of new tasks and serotonin to facilitate the interconnectivity between previously established connections.
Linkadge
Posted by Phidippus on October 5, 2010, at 22:40:16
In reply to any Musicians on meds?, posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
I perform all the time and I'm on:
Lithium 1200 mg
Anafranil 200 mg
Invega 6 mg
Memantine 40 mg
Vyvanse 50 mg
Opiates PRNIf anything, the drugs I'm on help me to create. I just can't do anything creative if my brainworks are out of balance.
P
Posted by Phidippus on October 5, 2010, at 22:40:58
In reply to any Musicians on meds?, posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
oh, yeah, go to:
P
Posted by Brainbeard on October 6, 2010, at 3:39:52
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds? » former poster, posted by Phidippus on October 5, 2010, at 22:40:16
> I perform all the time and I'm on:
>
> Lithium 1200 mg
> Anafranil 200 mg
> Invega 6 mg
> Memantine 40 mg
> Vyvanse 50 mg
> Opiates PRN
>
> If anything, the drugs I'm on help me to create. I just can't do anything creative if my brainworks are out of balance.
>
> PHey P!!! Interesting regimen! Finally got a cocktail that works? Cool we're both on high dose Anafranil. I still have to work with my p-doc on building a polypharmacotherapeutic Holy Grail.
-Brainbeard
Posted by Phidippus on October 6, 2010, at 14:18:13
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds?, posted by Brainbeard on October 6, 2010, at 3:39:52
> Hey P!!! Interesting regimen! Finally got a cocktail that works? Cool we're both on high dose Anafranil. I still have to work with my p-doc on building a polypharmacotherapeutic Holy Grail.
Dammnit, took 2 years to come up with this regimen and I'm still recording music and performing on some BAD days.
P
Lithium 1200 mg
Anafranil 200 mg
Invega 6 mg
Vyvanse 50 mg
Requip 4 mg
Ativan 1 mg PRN
Opiates PRN
MetropololADHD/OCD/BPI/CDH
Posted by Maxime on October 6, 2010, at 22:26:42
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds?, posted by Phillipa on October 5, 2010, at 12:17:07
Phillipa, it would be the same for a writer. Musicians, writers usually have problems creating if they are on an emotional blunting SSRI. But they feel that they are at their creative peak with hypomanic or manic.
Posted by Phillipa on October 7, 2010, at 19:15:04
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds? » Phillipa, posted by Maxime on October 6, 2010, at 22:26:42
Maxie makes sense to me. Thanks. Phillipa
Posted by Conundrum on October 8, 2010, at 12:31:41
In reply to any Musicians on meds?, posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
I used to play before I went on prozac and while I was on it. Right now I barely play at all. If I take a low dose of prozac, I am more motivated to play, but it doesn't bring me a whole lot more enjoyment and I still am not very creative, and the ideas I come up with are very simple. I was more creative a few years ago and while on prozac. Was too much of a nub before I took prozac to know if it had improved or hindered creative potential.
Most of the best stuff I wrote came from the turmoil after stopping prozac and dealing with the fears that I had about my emotional state and my brain.
Talking guitar here.
Posted by former poster on October 8, 2010, at 13:28:59
In reply to Re: any Musicians on meds? » former poster, posted by Conundrum on October 8, 2010, at 12:31:41
For me, all the A.D.'s improved my playing by motivating me to play, play longer without getting tired or bored, improved memory recall,(except Nardil) I think it even increased creativity. I think it made me take more chances to try different chords, scales, dittys etc. But when I tried the mood stabilizers, I didnt even want to play. When I forced myself to play, it was like I couldn't remember anything.
Maybe the A.D.'s made me slightly manic, if so then mania is good. I am really confused. Where or what is the threshold that is considered mania? Is mania always bad? I wonder how Vincent VanGough would have responded to Litihum?
Posted by bleauberry on October 8, 2010, at 17:22:24
In reply to any Musicians on meds?, posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
Composing and performing are two totally different scenarios. I think performing on most psychiatric meds make it hard to be good and sharp on stage. My experience anyway.
While playing a rock worship team in a church on a horrible depressing reaction to aweful Lexapro, I was in pure survival mode. Somehow the deep emotion I felt came through my fingers. So many people commented how touched they were by what I played. But it was a nightmare to me.
A single dose of Savella can help me do a better performance as long as I don't do too much. If too much, there is a norepinephrine adrenaline nervousness that gets in the way of concentrating. Scatterbrained.
If you have found one that works for a few hours or a day and you are comfortable with it, it can be helpful to get through the moment. I have never cancelled a show for any reason, not even the flu and not even suicidal depression....I rely on some med to get me through the same way someone would take a cold medicine for a cold.
For example, the only one that fits that description for me is Amisulpride. On a horrible day, it can lift me out of the dumps, cut the worst of the edge off of anxiety, sharpen my mind, warm me up, and have me deep into the performance with creative flare on stage. With continued use, it is useless to me. It's a one day thing, only as needed.
Ritalin can lift me from the dumps fast, but leaves me scatter brained and I have to struggle to remember details I've rehearsed hundreds of times. Not cool.
All antidepressants and antipsychotics make me so that I don't really even care about much of anything, and thus the performance lacks any flare. The lack of emotion on the inside shows on the outside as well. And in fact I don't even have any desire to compose or perform or to even open a guitar case or touch a keyboard except maybe out pure absolute boredom.
Tramadol made me deeply depressed and dark. On that day I wrote a song many consider their favorite...Moon Candles, on youtube. But I never ever could have performed it under the same circumstances.
Ritalin I find helpful once in a great while when I am determined to somehow get a new song written sometime in the day ahead of me. It has flopped too and the day ended with nothing to show, so it's not a for sure thing. If the song isn't really good, forget it, it goes in the trash. I don't want anything mediocre or amateur associated with my name. And I definitely cannot do a performance while on Ritalin.
But some people do indeed find something that could be called remission or near remission on a med or cocktail. In that situation, they can probably compose and perform very well and no one would even venture a guess they were on psych drugs.
As with everything in the psych world, it is purely trial and error with significant individual variability.
I hardly ever do drugs any more. In a dire emergency, the toolkit includes a small list of standbys such as Amisulpride, Ritalin, Vicodin, Savella. But these are only to get through the obligation, not for any longterm use because they ALWAYS make composition and performance worse with chronic usage.
In a strange kind of way, musicians who suffer psychiatric illnesses might even find some comfort in embracing their illness, because it makes them capable of producing special music that a normal healthy person could not. Kind of a cruel twisted gift, but a powerful gift. With me it is sort of a cruel choice....music or drugs. They don't mix, so make your choice.
That's probably one reason I am one of the lone wolves on this board that focuses more on FIXING the problem rather than drugging it.
Posted by bleauberry on October 8, 2010, at 17:30:37
In reply to any Musicians on meds?, posted by former poster on October 5, 2010, at 2:31:37
So my day was one of absolutely gut wrenching anxiety. Shaking fingers. Such deep depression the day looked like it would be a million miles long. How to keep my commitment to be on stage that night to a full house in a major club?
Out of previous experience and experimentation, I knew my choices were:
1. 12.5mg Amisulpride
2. 50mg Diflucan + 12.5mg DMSA.I did all three. About two hours before the show, anxiety vanished. Calm, socializing, mingling. Sharp on stage. The only lingering problem was shaking fingers. And a soundman that had my monitor way too loud and distracting.
That performance can be seen on youtube.
Tag words:
Moon Candles
Sassy
Remember
D1
LaFollette
Tear Down These WallsI'm glad some people can do well on fulltime meds, but I sure don't do well that way. I wish I could.
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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