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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by herpills on December 16, 2010, at 14:34:57
I've had to accept the fact that I'm probably going to have to stay on multiple meds to control my symptoms (in order of severity, depression, anxiety, hypomania)
I've tried monotherapy, with Lamictal or Lexapro, and it just doesn't work for me. The closest I came was with Lamictal + supplements but I still had a severe depression relapse.
herpills
Posted by mrtook on December 16, 2010, at 16:02:53
In reply to thoughts on 'polypharmacy', posted by herpills on December 16, 2010, at 14:34:57
I am not trying to go therapist on you, but does this upset you and if so why?
Posted by Phillipa on December 16, 2010, at 16:39:10
In reply to thoughts on 'polypharmacy', posted by herpills on December 16, 2010, at 14:34:57
So herpills you are bipolar? And lexapro, lamictal works for you? I feel you are very lucky they are working and would feel happy. Continue on the meds and don't think about it. Seriously wish I also was as lucky as you. Love Phillipa
Posted by Christ_empowered on December 16, 2010, at 17:22:44
In reply to Re: thoughts on 'polypharmacy' » herpills, posted by Phillipa on December 16, 2010, at 16:39:10
lots of people are on 2+ meds, especially in bipolar-land. Try not to feel bad about it; you do what you have to do to stay stable and maintain your quality of life.
Posted by mellow on December 17, 2010, at 4:53:55
In reply to thoughts on 'polypharmacy', posted by herpills on December 16, 2010, at 14:34:57
> I've had to accept the fact that I'm probably going to have to stay on multiple meds to control my symptoms (in order of severity, depression, anxiety, hypomania)
>
> I've tried monotherapy, with Lamictal or Lexapro, and it just doesn't work for me. The closest I came was with Lamictal + supplements but I still had a severe depression relapse.
>
> herpillsI can feel you on this one, but I am actually going in the opposite direction as you right now. I'm trying to get to Lamictal monotherapy with vitamins and fish oil. That is the goal my doctor and I have set for 2011.
It was driven into me that I was "sick" and needed to be medicated for the rest of my life for so many years. I was on a 4 drug cocktail for years and finally got the SSRI (Lexapro for many years/Celexa in the end) out of my cocktail. Very difficult transition, but have worlds more energy, more interest in the bedroom, it's much easier to socialize and I have a lot more self esteem. I just feel better in general.
I'm hoping that one daily dose of Lamotrogine (I'm at 150 mg right now) can get me where I need to be. Tapering my Risperdal may prove a challenge, but we are starting in January.
I just don't think polypharmacy works. I was on a big cocktail which was manipulated to "get me stable" often for five years and still had suicidal thoughts, was very ocd, tons of irritability and I was sleeping 14 hours a day. I also gained 80 pounds.
I finally made a full commitment to therapy and have been seeing the same woman for 2 years where I have worked through a ton of issues. This is where the breakthrough happened for me. Feeling physically and mentally better for the last several months (especially during winter) leads me to believe I can have a very med limited or even med free life.
I certainly think psych drugs are effective in acute situations. I would be dead had I not been sedated and forced to sleep off psychotic episodes years ago, but we also have the ability to learn coping mechanisms and move with life's flow.
I am pretty passionate about this stuff as I feel like I was poorly medicated for several years and was very close to hurting myself last year. I'm not trying to grandstand I just think the idea of accepting polypharmacy is dangerous...it does not give one the affirmation that they are capable of living the good life...that they are a good person with a lot to offer this world. It reinforces the message that we as the patient are "defective" or have "disorders" and should submit to the side effects and hope for the best.
That's not a life I'm willing to accept..there is something better out there for all of us!
mellow
Posted by Lou Pilder on December 17, 2010, at 6:06:17
In reply to Re: thoughts on 'polypharmacy', posted by mellow on December 17, 2010, at 4:53:55
> > I've had to accept the fact that I'm probably going to have to stay on multiple meds to control my symptoms (in order of severity, depression, anxiety, hypomania)
> >
> > I've tried monotherapy, with Lamictal or Lexapro, and it just doesn't work for me. The closest I came was with Lamictal + supplements but I still had a severe depression relapse.
> >
> > herpills
>
> I can feel you on this one, but I am actually going in the opposite direction as you right now. I'm trying to get to Lamictal monotherapy with vitamins and fish oil. That is the goal my doctor and I have set for 2011.
>
> It was driven into me that I was "sick" and needed to be medicated for the rest of my life for so many years. I was on a 4 drug cocktail for years and finally got the SSRI (Lexapro for many years/Celexa in the end) out of my cocktail. Very difficult transition, but have worlds more energy, more interest in the bedroom, it's much easier to socialize and I have a lot more self esteem. I just feel better in general.
>
> I'm hoping that one daily dose of Lamotrogine (I'm at 150 mg right now) can get me where I need to be. Tapering my Risperdal may prove a challenge, but we are starting in January.
>
> I just don't think polypharmacy works. I was on a big cocktail which was manipulated to "get me stable" often for five years and still had suicidal thoughts, was very ocd, tons of irritability and I was sleeping 14 hours a day. I also gained 80 pounds.
>
> I finally made a full commitment to therapy and have been seeing the same woman for 2 years where I have worked through a ton of issues. This is where the breakthrough happened for me. Feeling physically and mentally better for the last several months (especially during winter) leads me to believe I can have a very med limited or even med free life.
>
> I certainly think psych drugs are effective in acute situations. I would be dead had I not been sedated and forced to sleep off psychotic episodes years ago, but we also have the ability to learn coping mechanisms and move with life's flow.
>
> I am pretty passionate about this stuff as I feel like I was poorly medicated for several years and was very close to hurting myself last year. I'm not trying to grandstand I just think the idea of accepting polypharmacy is dangerous...it does not give one the affirmation that they are capable of living the good life...that they are a good person with a lot to offer this world. It reinforces the message that we as the patient are "defective" or have "disorders" and should submit to the side effects and hope for the best.
>
> That's not a life I'm willing to accept..there is something better out there for all of us!
>
> mellow
>
> mellow,
You wrote,[...that's not a life I'm willing to accept...].
Could you post here, if you know, what led you to take that stand? If you could, then I could have the opportunity to have dialog with you in hopes to be of help to you and others. I think that your post has the potential to save lives and/or to prevent one from getting a life-ruining condition
Lou
Posted by linkadge on December 17, 2010, at 18:31:38
In reply to Lou's response-ehylyt » mellow, posted by Lou Pilder on December 17, 2010, at 6:06:17
The polypharamacy just takes a toll on the brain. All of these meds have toxicities. Some meds are directly cyotoxic, others indireclty supress normal cellular viability.
When you start ingesting multiple p meds, your brain just atrophies.
Linkadge
Posted by herpills on December 17, 2010, at 19:04:17
In reply to Re: thoughts on 'polypharmacy', posted by mrtook on December 16, 2010, at 16:02:53
> I am not trying to go therapist on you, but does this upset you and if so why?
It bothers me. It makes me feel like I've failed at other non medication approaches, even though I have been in therapy before, and I exercise. I suppose I could eat healthier.
I worry about the effects of these drugs on my body/mind.
Posted by emmanuel98 on December 17, 2010, at 19:05:29
In reply to Re: 'chemo' brain, posted by linkadge on December 17, 2010, at 18:31:38
> The polypharamacy just takes a toll on the brain. All of these meds have toxicities. Some meds are directly cyotoxic, others indireclty supress normal cellular viability.
>
> When you start ingesting multiple p meds, your brain just atrophies.
>
> LinkadgeI don't find this to be true. I take three meds, plus one more for insomnia (caused by the other meds) and my brain hasn't atrophied at all. I feel fine. I have gone back to school and gotten all A's in a very difficult program, where most of the students are hanging by a thread to pass. This might be your experience, but it's certainly not everyone's experience.
Also, unlike mellow, I don't see myself as a loser or a "patient" just because I use psych meds. I do therapy every week with a DBT therapist and once a month with my p-doc, who I used to see every week. I have been able to cut back with him, because, having found the right combo of meds, I am no longer severely depressed.
The negativity about meds on this board is incredible. Some people do very well on psych meds. In fact, a lot of people do.
Posted by linkadge on December 18, 2010, at 7:41:35
In reply to Re: 'chemo' brain, posted by emmanuel98 on December 17, 2010, at 19:05:29
Well, I guess there is a bit of a tradeoff.
For example, in long term studies, use of multiple anticonvulsants is associated with all sorts of pathological alterations in the brain. However, for these people multiple drugs may be necessary to control seizures and lead a somewhat normal life.
In such cases, cognition may improve acutely upon sucessful treatment of the epilepsy. But, this improvement is not indicative of the neurological safety of such regiments.
Its just like all the people who claim ECT improved their cognition. This may be true (in that the treatments resolved severe depression), however I would argue strongly that structurally, their brain really isn't in a better place (post ECT) dispite some short term functional improvments
Linkadge
Posted by 49er on December 18, 2010, at 8:07:21
In reply to Re: 'chemo' brain, posted by emmanuel98 on December 17, 2010, at 19:05:29
> I don't find this to be true. I take three meds, plus one more for insomnia (caused by the other meds) and my brain hasn't atrophied at all. I feel fine. I have gone back to school and gotten all A's in a very difficult program, where most of the students are hanging by a thread to pass. This might be your experience, but it's certainly not everyone's experience.
>
> Also, unlike mellow, I don't see myself as a loser or a "patient" just because I use psych meds. I do therapy every week with a DBT therapist and once a month with my p-doc, who I used to see every week. I have been able to cut back with him, because, having found the right combo of meds, I am no longer severely depressed.
>
> The negativity about meds on this board is incredible. Some people do very well on psych meds. In fact, a lot of people do.
>
>
Hi Emanuel,As one who used to take psych meds, I find your reaction interesting because that is exactly how I used to respond when I felt people were attacking psych meds. I am wondering if I reacted that way because I felt my judgment was being questioned with the implication I was doing something dangerous. Just wondering and I would love to hear input from people on this.
I agree that no one is a loser if they decide to take meds. By the way, dealing with some very difficult situations recently made me realize why people resort to psych meds and why I did in the past. Not that I would wish this on anyone but it was a great experience to have as a reminder of different strokes for different folks.
By the way, I initially felt meds made me smarter. But over time, I felt stupider and it definitely was not depression related. Hopefully, you won't have the same experience.
I honestly think we are never going to know exactly who does well and who doesn't on psych meds because doctors in general don't want to hear about side effects. Generally, complaints are falsely attributed to the person's mental illness.
I think this problem exists with all doctors and not just psychiatry. Google statin side effects and doctors as there was a survey that showed that they denied common side effects.
Also, if only 1 to 10% of all side effects are ever reported to the FDA, how can we really know who is doing well on meds and who isn't?
Anyway, that is great that your treatment is working.
49er
Posted by mellow on December 18, 2010, at 14:10:33
In reply to Re: 'chemo' brain, posted by emmanuel98 on December 17, 2010, at 19:05:29
I certainly don't think anyone who takes psych meds is a loser. Those words were put in my mouth. I was trying to state that not everyone has to accept polypharmacy so nonchalantly.
If it's helping that's great. It has changed my body in very strange ways. My histamine levels have got to be off. Sometimes I can't breath. I have night terrors and leap out of bed since stopping Celexa and I sweat like a pig no matter how I set my AC. Simply stating my experience.
I will lay off this thread. I don't want to trigger anyone.
Posted by linkadge on December 19, 2010, at 6:56:17
In reply to Re: 'chemo' brain » emmanuel98, posted by 49er on December 18, 2010, at 8:07:21
>I am wondering if I reacted that way because I >felt my judgment was being questioned with the >implication I was doing something dangerous. >Just wondering and I would love to hear input >from people on this.
Yes, when you're on drugs, you're.......on drugs.
Meds can also induce hypomania. The accompanying self confidence can mask the deleterious cognitive effects of some meds.
Linkadge
Posted by emmanuel98 on December 19, 2010, at 19:25:35
In reply to Re: 'chemo' brain » emmanuel98, posted by 49er on December 18, 2010, at 8:07:21
> Hi Emanuel,
>
> As one who used to take psych meds, I find your reaction interesting because that is exactly how I used to respond when I felt people were attacking psych meds. I am wondering if I reacted that way because I felt my judgment was being questioned with the implication I was doing something dangerous. Just wondering and I would love to hear input from people on this.I don't object because my I think my judgement is being questioned. I have just had very good luck with parnate -- no side effects, no getting stupider, no fogginess or loss of libido. I also had a good response to abilify and risperadal, but they made me gain weight like crazy. I stopped trying the AAPs and went into a severe depression where my mind was completely useless. I couldn't think or talk or get out of bed. Taking parnate was like waking up from a nightmare for me.
This is the end of the thread.
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