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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by jonhed on May 25, 2016, at 12:55:12
In reply to MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 11:31:43
And for high doses zyprexa,
I had 40 mg zyprexa when i had psychosis a couple of years ago. It did help but i got a little "out of it" sometimes and could wake up in the middle of the night and think it was morning, i was taking a shower, brushed my teeth and put on my clothes before i realized that it was still night and i had been sleeping for like 30 minutes.
this happened like 7 times in a 6 week period.At the most in sweden you can get 30mg fast acting intramuscular injection of zyprexa (not the depot) and it doers the same thing to me.
My speech get very slurred to a point that people do not hear a word i say.
BUT i urge you to seek the psychiatric charge (the one with locked doors) if you are going to do that, because 100 mg of zyprexa can give you rebound psychosis.
That happened to me when i overdosed on it at home. it is very dangerous..The fast acting IM zyprexa is, in my opinion, the best anti-psychotic medication you can get, because you get a well being and almost euphoria at the same time your hallucinations disappear.
Remember that this is my experience and i'm not a doctor.
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 14:42:53
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by jonhed on May 25, 2016, at 12:55:12
I have TRD but not TRP(sychosis). MAOI trigger psychosis in me. I wonder if i could tame them with megadoses of APs.
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 14:45:53
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 14:42:53
I should add that MAOI (and SJW) are the only things that ever really worked for depression. But they triggered psychosis. Thats why i wonder if i could make it work.
Venlafaxine is only 30% effective. So not that good.
Posted by linkadge on May 25, 2016, at 18:12:40
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 14:45:53
Antipsychotics will cancel (to some extent) the effect of certain antidepressants.
Psychosis isn't always due to too much dopamine.
We know so little about the true origins of schizophrenia.
For some, its likely due to more fundamental issues with cell function or synaptic connectivity, not simply too much dopamine.
I still recommend niacin as an adjunct to an antipsychotic.
Linkadge
Posted by PeterMartin on May 26, 2016, at 1:59:24
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 14:45:53
You say MAOis make you psychotic. Have you tried l 3? I had a bad psychotic episode after adding Nardil to a cocktail in 2006. However I've now been on Maplan for 6yrs w/o an episode.
They're similar but Nardil is definitely more powerful (Gaba etc).
Posted by J Kelly on May 26, 2016, at 5:43:12
In reply to MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 11:31:43
> I have heard of Zyprexa dosages up to 100mgs. Now i cant imagine that i would still be psychotic at that dosage.
I'm now up to 10mg Zyprexa and 1.5mg Klonopin with 75mg Nardil. No psychosis so far (knock on wood).
Jade
Posted by J Kelly on May 26, 2016, at 5:47:07
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by PeterMartin on May 26, 2016, at 1:59:24
> I had a bad psychotic episode after adding Nardil to a cocktail in 2006.
Would you mind sharing what that cocktail was, doses etc., and how long it took to become psychotic?
Thanks,
Jade
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 6:56:27
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP??? » Lamdage22, posted by J Kelly on May 26, 2016, at 5:43:12
> > I have heard of Zyprexa dosages up to 100mgs. Now i cant imagine that i would still be psychotic at that dosage.
>
> I'm now up to 10mg Zyprexa and 1.5mg Klonopin with 75mg Nardil. No psychosis so far (knock on wood).
>
>
> JadeThat sounds good Jade.
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 7:23:37
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 6:56:27
I think Wellbutrin is the way to go here. Im not even asking my doctor because he brought up the idea anyway couple months ago.
Posted by Christ_empowered on May 26, 2016, at 8:35:18
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 7:23:37
If you can avoid unusually high doses of AP/AAP drugs, you probably should.
I think Wellbutrin would be helpful. Using neurontin might help, too (I'm clearly not an expert, lol)...my concern right now would be that adding a standard dose of neurontin might be too sedating with everything else you're on.
I was reading...adding Lamictal to ongoing AP/AAP treatment is apparently good for many people. Lamictal is also one of the more tolerable anticonvulsants. In what I read, the authors said that, in their experience, adding lamictal can somehow help keep the neuroleptic dose lower over the long haul. I don't understand the brain, so I don't know what the technical explanation is/was, but...makes sense. Benzodiazepines have also been used to reduce neuroleptic dosages and keep them lower over long term treatment.
Hope this helps.
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 8:47:14
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Christ_empowered on May 26, 2016, at 8:35:18
no lamictal doesnt do anything
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 8:47:43
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 8:47:14
I am on the verge of being suicidal
Posted by jonhed on May 26, 2016, at 9:33:42
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 8:47:43
Please let me raise awareness for opioids without getting talked down (moral stuff, i can't translate it from my langue).
My grandfather was diagnosed with schizophrenia back in the 70s and so was my uncle.
I have 3 friends who is diagnosed with schizophrenia in some form and the only thing that have helped them with there suicidal thoughts and(!) with they're paranoia, is opioids.In some countries you can get buprenorphine for treatment resistant depression, it is not that uncommon.
And buprenorphine is very stimulating to + an Kappa-opioid receptor antagonist, which has been proved many times to be very effective against depression.We are going to se more and more new opioid-receptor agonists in a few years.
especially K-opioid ligands, i believe.
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 9:38:30
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by jonhed on May 26, 2016, at 9:33:42
> Please let me raise awareness for opioids without getting talked down (moral stuff, i can't translate it from my langue).
>
> My grandfather was diagnosed with schizophrenia back in the 70s and so was my uncle.
> I have 3 friends who is diagnosed with schizophrenia in some form and the only thing that have helped them with there suicidal thoughts and(!) with they're paranoia, is opioids.
>
> In some countries you can get buprenorphine for treatment resistant depression, it is not that uncommon.
> And buprenorphine is very stimulating to + an Kappa-opioid receptor antagonist, which has been proved many times to be very effective against depression.
>
> We are going to se more and more new opioid-receptor agonists in a few years.
>
> especially K-opioid ligands, i believe.When i google Buprenorphin and Depression, i dont come across anything in German. That has me believe that in Germany it is never used for psychiatric stuff:(
Too bad.
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 9:43:28
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Christ_empowered on May 26, 2016, at 8:35:18
> If you can avoid unusually high doses of AP/AAP drugs, you probably should.
Even if it means that i am suicidal?
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 13:42:27
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 9:43:28
I havent tried this yet.
But i want to be in a hospital when i try.
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 13:57:51
In reply to Wanna try Luvox, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 13:42:27
> I havent tried this yet.
>
> But i want to be in a hospital when i try.Because at home i get scared and discontinue prematurely.
Posted by Christ_empowered on May 26, 2016, at 16:08:40
In reply to Re: Wanna try Luvox, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 13:57:51
Luvox has all kindsa drug-drug interactions, and it tends to be sedating.
Why not...lexapro, celexa?
Posted by PeterMartin on May 26, 2016, at 20:27:05
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP??? » PeterMartin, posted by J Kelly on May 26, 2016, at 5:47:07
> > I had a bad psychotic episode after adding Nardil to a cocktail in 2006.
>
> Would you mind sharing what that cocktail was, doses etc., and how long it took to become psychotic?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jade
>
>
>It wasn't really a fair trial as I was young and stupid at the time. I had a sorta addiction to pot and that alone can sometimes induce psychosis in me. If I remember it was just Nardil and seroquel but + pot I went off. At that time I had been smoking pot daily since 2003 w.o. any probs so I always attributed the episode to Nardil when it could have been coincidence or MAOIs in general.
Marplan is mild for me but it does do enough to the point I'm not asking my doc for other meds......that's a good sign for me.
Posted by J Kelly on May 27, 2016, at 5:55:11
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 26, 2016, at 8:47:43
> I am on the verge of being suicidal
Lamdage :(
I just saw this. I'm so sorry you are feeling this bad. Can you get an emergency appt with your pdoc? Maybe he can get a little more creative with that prescription pad when he hears how you're feeling. Do you feel like you should go to the hospital?
Ley me know if there is anything I can do for you (research etc).
Hang in there things will get better. I was about to give up also when I found Nardil. You will find something that helps. I just know it.
your friend,
Jade
Posted by J Kelly on May 27, 2016, at 7:10:16
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by jonhed on May 26, 2016, at 9:33:42
> Please let me raise awareness for opioids without getting talked down (moral stuff, i can't translate it from my langue).
>
> My grandfather was diagnosed with schizophrenia back in the 70s and so was my uncle.
> I have 3 friends who is diagnosed with schizophrenia in some form and the only thing that have helped them with there suicidal thoughts and(!) with they're paranoia, is opioids.
>
> In some countries you can get buprenorphine for treatment resistant depression, it is not that uncommon.
> And buprenorphine is very stimulating to + an Kappa-opioid receptor antagonist, which has been proved many times to be very effective against depression.
>
> We are going to se more and more new opioid-receptor agonists in a few years.
>
> especially K-opioid ligands, i believe.My pdoc prescribed Suboxone for me once as I was coming out of a psychotic state. I guess it was for depression or w/d from parnate. I was pretty out of it so I'm not sure. I remember I felt pretty good on it. Not all pdocs can prescribe it.
Jade
Posted by J Kelly on May 27, 2016, at 7:13:29
In reply to MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 25, 2016, at 11:31:43
> I have heard of Zyprexa dosages up to 100mgs. Now i cant imagine that i would still be psychotic at that dosage.
So...
Luvox, suboxone, high dose AP, and what about a stim? Ritalin always helps my depression/ADD.
Jade
Posted by J Kelly on May 27, 2016, at 7:20:58
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by PeterMartin on May 26, 2016, at 20:27:05
> > > I had a bad psychotic episode after adding Nardil to a cocktail in 2006.
> >
> > Would you mind sharing what that cocktail was, doses etc., and how long it took to become psychotic?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Jade
> >
> >
> >
>
> It wasn't really a fair trial as I was young and stupid at the time. I had a sorta addiction to pot and that alone can sometimes induce psychosis in me. If I remember it was just Nardil and seroquel but + pot I went off. At that time I had been smoking pot daily since 2003 w.o. any probs so I always attributed the episode to Nardil when it could have been coincidence or MAOIs in general.
>
> Marplan is mild for me but it does do enough to the point I'm not asking my doc for other meds......that's a good sign for me.
>Hi dose parnate was pulling me out of depression when I became psychotic. Its taken me years to get the courage up to try another MAOI. I'm taking 75mg Nardil plus 10mg Zyprexa. I love the feel of Nardil. I hope I don't have to give it up.
Jade
Posted by Lamdage22 on May 27, 2016, at 7:50:02
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP??? » PeterMartin, posted by J Kelly on May 27, 2016, at 7:20:58
i want luvox. I am checking into a clinic as i am tired of trialing meds alone at home.
Posted by jonhed on May 27, 2016, at 12:06:52
In reply to Re: MAOI + super high dose AP???, posted by Lamdage22 on May 27, 2016, at 7:50:02
I feel with you lamdage22..
Nowadays i can't start up new medicines at home because it always, 100% of the times, end up with me being paranoid and discontinue it after a maximum of 4 days.
That is 4 days without sleep, without food and severe panic attacks.I think you're doing the right thing to check in to a clinic if you have that opportunity, there you are in a safe environment and even with side effects you can still reassure you that if something happens, you are at least in a hospital!
If you decide to do so, i have some tips for you that i want you to consider to talk about your doctor about.(and just as a fellow sufferer, not an expert).
This is just tips, not rules or guidelines.1. Please tell him about the severity of your depression and that you don't want to try things you've already have tried and that you very much like to be a part of the discussion about your medications.
If you want to try a high dose of luvox, then stand your ground!
You have rights to.2. If you don't already have tried it - High dose of amitriptyline, 250mg at least, with quick titration (2-3 weeks).
3. Zyprexa IM 10mg 3 Times in one or two days. That is if you're experience a psychotic depression.
It is in my opinion the far best AAP/AD combination medicine i know.4. As for benzodiazepines in the beginning of an AD treatment, i would suggest nitrazepam 10mg, two times daily, as it is a full agonist of the benzodiazepine receptor and works far better than alprazolam in the short term.
5. Ask your doctor about what he can tell you about "TMS - Transcranial Magnet Stimulation".
I have no experience from it or anything really, but in a few moth i am going to undergo TMS-treatment.
The only thing i know is that it is not acute dangerous and does not require any Anesthesia or convulsions like ECT.6. Ask your doctor about it's experience of nmda-antagonists as adjunct to other medicines that does build up tolerance. Maybe that can help you to maintain the initial antidepressant effect from various anxiolytics without upping the dose.
I've heard that Memantine can be used.
Ask your doctor about Amantadine. I've heard good things about it.7. As last resort, ask your doctor to consider high potency opioids with long half life. Methadone or Buprenorphine.
Even if it's not recommended in your country, he/she can still prescribe whatever he/she wants, for whatever he/she wants.
It's not recommended in sweden either but as i have said, there is some very prominent evidence for it's AD effect.8. Start up CBT-therapy in the long term.
I hope this is to some help for you because i care about all you guys and would not write this just for fun.
It took me one hour due to the fact that i'm not english speaking./J
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