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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Nadezda on September 19, 2008, at 11:04:44
My self=esteem is at a very low ebb right now.
My T seems to have no respect for me, and to be pushing me relentlessly, even contemptuously, to do things that I'm afraid to do. He seems to have lost patience with me, and to be resorting to this kind of constant annoyance at what he sees as my "excuses."
I had been working toward going to a class last night-- that I'm having all these fears and crazy phantasies about-- building the teacher up into this giant who will hate me, etc. Yesterday during the day, I thought I could go. Then my painting in the afternoon went really badly and I lost any confidence in myself that I had tried to connect to. I just couldn't face being in a situation where I felt so worthless.
I haven't gone to see my T for my last two appointments, including this morning, because I can't face the barrage of criticism and also I feel pretty much like a complete failure. I honestly think I never will be able to go and do a lot of things that other people can do, and I don't understand what's the matter with me, and why my mind goes crazy when I'm faced with something that just isn't that hard.
I'm completely bummed out right now.
Nadezda
Posted by Sigismund on September 19, 2008, at 15:39:54
In reply to Self-esteem crash, posted by Nadezda on September 19, 2008, at 11:04:44
>My T seems to have no respect for me, and to be pushing me relentlessly, even contemptuously, to do things that I'm afraid to do. He seems to have lost patience with me, and to be resorting to this kind of constant annoyance at what he sees as my "excuses."
Hey, this sounds really awful. I was trying once to explain to my doctor why I couldn't do much (procrastination) and he asked why and I said I just didn't feel right and he reacted (in the way you refer to) by saying that I was just wallowing and that he was pleased he was brought up with a German work ethic. Only later did it come to me that I could have said 'O yes, you're famous for it' (As it was I just thanked him with what I hoped was a decently remorse-inducing depressed tone). I didn't go back; things had been getting slowly worse for ages.
>I haven't gone to see my T for my last two appointments, including this morning, because I can't face the barrage of criticism and also I feel pretty much like a complete failure. I honestly think I never will be able to go and do a lot of things that other people can do, and I don't understand what's the matter with me, and why my mind goes crazy when I'm faced with something that just isn't that hard.
Anyway, I thought I'd done OK just saying that I didn't feel right. (What did he expect? That I would say 'I have the knife in my bag'?)
It is nice if you can understand what the matter with you is, but if it was easy you would have already done it.
Posted by Sigismund on September 19, 2008, at 15:50:06
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Nadezda, posted by Sigismund on September 19, 2008, at 15:39:54
Perhaps you could use the Tao Te Ching or the Chuang Tsu as a sort of counterpoint?
Posted by Nadezda on September 19, 2008, at 19:46:43
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash, posted by Sigismund on September 19, 2008, at 15:50:06
Thanks for the suggestion.
Any part that you think is most important?
Nadezda
Posted by Sigismund on September 19, 2008, at 20:41:30
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Sigismund, posted by Nadezda on September 19, 2008, at 19:46:43
This is a little oblique, not to say ironical......
'The wise therefore rule by emptying hearts and stuffing bellies, by weakening ambitions and strengthening bones.
If people lack knowledge and desire, then intellectuals will not try to interfere.
If nothing is done then all will be well.'Perhaps this?........
'Who can be quiet while the mud settles?
Who can remain still until the moment of action?
Observers of the Tao do not seek fulfillment.
Not seeking fulfillment, they are not swayed by desire for change.'I liked this.....
'When the great Tao is forgotten
Kindness and morality arise.
When wisdom and intelligence are born,
The great pretense begins.'This was what I had in mind......
'The beginning of the universe
Is the mother of all things.
Knowing the mother, one also knows the sons.
Knowing the sons, yet remaining in touch with the mother,
Brings freedom from the fear of death.Keep your mouth shut,
Guard the senses,
And life is ever full.
Open your mouth, always be busy,
And life is beyond hope.'
Posted by Nadezda on September 20, 2008, at 11:47:17
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash and ironical Taoists, posted by Sigismund on September 19, 2008, at 20:41:30
Do I sense anti-intellectualism in Eastern Thought? hmmm.
But I did wonder while I was reading that myself-- I thought the scholar or wise man was supposed to save us all.
I enjoyed reading the verses though. I may refer back.
Thanks, Sigismund
Posted by llurpsienoodle on September 20, 2008, at 12:23:42
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash and ironical Taoists, posted by Nadezda on September 20, 2008, at 11:47:17
Oh my...
My little brain cannot expand to hold such dialectical thoughtNad, sux that you're getting tough love from T ((((Nad))))
could it be that your T is threatened that the DBT is helping you in a way that he couldn't?
At any rate, I'm kinda jealous that you've gotten the chance to do some good DBT work. My T tells me I need to learn how to soothe myself. Then he tells me in the next sentence that when he was growing up, his dad tried to undermine his mother's soothing him (babyT). As a result, he says that he often has to check his instincts as a father himself, that he doesn't undermine his wife's style of raising their son.
No wonder I don't want to present him with intense distress. He'd intellectualize it. Maybe I should call him out on this? That would be spicy!
Can you find a kid to paint with?
-Ll
Posted by Phillipa on September 20, 2008, at 12:57:59
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Nadezda, posted by Sigismund on September 19, 2008, at 15:39:54
Sigi have German Grandfather died when Mother two but what is the German work ethic? Love PJ
Posted by Nadezda on September 20, 2008, at 17:46:38
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Sigismund, posted by Phillipa on September 20, 2008, at 12:57:59
Hi, Phillipa. I"m not sure I understand your question. Could you reframe it so I understand how it fits in or what you're getting at?
thanks
Nadezda
Posted by Sigismund on September 20, 2008, at 18:41:46
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Sigismund, posted by Phillipa on September 20, 2008, at 12:57:59
>what is the German work ethic?
Well, I dunno, I guess they work hard. It was just my doc's way of saying that I was lazy and kinda disgusting. And I felt that violated the 'first do no harm' rule, so I didn't go back.
Posted by Nadezda on September 20, 2008, at 20:05:56
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Phillipa, posted by Sigismund on September 20, 2008, at 18:41:46
That guy sounds sort of self-important. You do wonder how it's supposed to help you to know that he's pleased with his own work-ethic.
My T tries to claim he's doing it for my benefit. I keep feeling that he could do more for my benefit if he did whatever he's doing in gentler, or less cutting way. He doesn't agree. Or he also doesn't agree that he's being mean. In fact, he strongly suggests that he's not going to put up with my saying that-- when I mentioned that anyway.
Maybe I need to work on not being so upset if he doesn't like what I"m doing. Not an easy thing, though-- since I frequently myself feel disappointed in what I'm doing.
Or maybe I do exaggerate the sarcasm. I don't suppose I could be completely making it up though. I'd hate to think I was capable of so misreading another person for so long, and not being able to correct my false impression.
Nadezda
Posted by Phillipa on September 20, 2008, at 20:12:19
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Phillipa, posted by Sigismund on September 20, 2008, at 18:41:46
Sigi used to really work hard so you figure you're lazy doubt that. Love PJ
Posted by Nadezda on September 21, 2008, at 21:03:30
In reply to Re: Self-esteem crash » Phillipa, posted by Sigismund on September 20, 2008, at 18:41:46
On the other hand, maybe there's a new German work ethic. I read this on a blog by someone who had lived in Europe.
"No, my friend, you'll need to move to another country, one like Germany, to overcome your workaholism. I was never a real workaholic American, but nevertheless I once worked for four years in American without ever taking a substantial vacation. Perhaps it goes back to my mother. Among many wonderful pieces of advice she gave me, she also delivered maxims like this: "The work you do is the rent you pay for the space you occupy." Saying a sentence like that out loud in Germany could get you referred for mental health treatment.
I admit, there's enough of the workaholic in me that it took me a while to adapt to the German work ethic. I still do 3 or 4 hours of work on the weekend, just to silence my workaholic conscience. But other than that, I am delighted with the work/life balance here in Europe."
Nadezda
Posted by Phillipa on September 22, 2008, at 20:01:52
In reply to Re: German work ethic, posted by Nadezda on September 21, 2008, at 21:03:30
Europe gives wonderfully long vacations. And they seem very casual in work time. Was there with an ex of mine and meetings were elaborate affairs in fancy restaurants. Phillipa
Posted by Sigismund on September 23, 2008, at 15:01:24
In reply to Re: German work ethic, posted by Nadezda on September 21, 2008, at 21:03:30
After he left the US my son spent a little time in Germany, and commented on the punky counterculture in Berlin....you know, anarchists and political types largely unknown atm (I suspect) in the US. My doctor may have been brought up in sterner times.
We had an Insight SBS program on the US election last night, so we got to see a range of opinion and see the differences between here and over there, including the fact that the election will be held on a *Tuesday*.
Posted by Sigismund on September 23, 2008, at 15:12:33
In reply to Re: German work ethic » Nadezda, posted by Sigismund on September 23, 2008, at 15:01:24
One thing he recalled was people going to street parties wearing gas masks (which may have even more resonance in Germany).
This is the end of the thread.
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