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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by mandinka on October 4, 2004, at 18:41:51
Hi!
I'm new to this board but I've been reading your posts for some time. As I am in need of support and would also like to share my story as a cautionary tale, I decided to post. It's a long post so better get your favorite beverage and a comfy chair before proceeding...
I don't have much experience with psychotherapy. The last time I've been to a therapist was when I was 18 and that was many years ago. It didn't do anything for me. I decided to return to therapy now but unfortunately I received a serious blow right at the beginning.
I started regressive therapy with a man who is a specialist in his field. I was with him for two months. Things went pretty well. Even though sometimes I found his gestalt methods somewhat rough I held on, because my therapist had real depth and a big heart.
The last session before things fell apart he was laughing, he said I could tell him everything and informed me that whenever I wanted to, I could call him and he would call me back asap or right in the morning the next day - he knew I hesitated to call him and he was trying to coax me out of hiding. He was really pleased - we had a breakthrough that day and I felt happy for the first time since I don't remember when. The warmth coming from him was like a ray of light in my frozen internal life. He gave me hope.
Four days later he emailed me and left a message on my phone that because of health problems he had to terminate our relationship. This relationship was supposed to last several years and become a foundation for my reparenting and repatterning. I called him of course immediately - he was distant, brief and rather cold.
I cannot describe what a horrible blow the termination was to me. My therapist became the father I lost as a small girl, someone I looked up to (I was in a pretty regressed state with him). I was right in the middle of the symbiotic, merging phase. I had for T1 strong feelings typical of a baby bonding with a mother, a positive father transference and a negative transference stemming from another relationship in my life. The strength of those emotions scared me but he seemed okay with them. I had a very bad pre- and perinatal period which left me with terror, anxiety and mistrust of people. My history reinforced the theme of severe abandonement in my life. You can imagine what him leaving me meant to me.
He placed me promptly with another, female therapist also working in the regressive, reparenting mode - a very empathic and wise woman whom I really like but the blow I received is so severe that still after almost two months I am crying every day and just cannot pick myself up.
I had two more sessions with my old T (T1) but there was no closure, because the real issues were never addressed. He said nice things about me both to me and my new T (T2) but simply treated this time as a "cool down" period, not a time to have an in-depth discussion about the problems at hand. I didn't want to talk to him about how angry, betrayed and heartbroken I felt. He would have to be fully present and open for me to do just that and I intuitively knew he wasn't, even though I had no proof to validate these perceptions.
T2 and I agreed that the health story (T1 served her this story too) was a sham and the real reasons for my termination were different. I wrote T1 a letter in which I pointed out the incongruities between his behavior and words. Right after this letter, T2 confronted my old T and he admitted that the real issue was countertransference but he said nothing about its nature. He was - as T2 described him - "guarded and defensive". Our relationship had to blow out of the water for him something that blasted in his face with such force that he was incapable of working with me anymore (I doubt it was an erotic countertransference). He came up with the health story because he had no intention of sharing with me the real reasons for our split. I guess both his strong boundaries and sense of vulnerability made it impossible for him to talk to me about what was really going on with him, even though I asked him several times to open up to me. He just avoided the issue or gave me some trivial reasons for the termination. He's a good person - an opinion confirmed by other therapists that know him - but his own pain blinded him to the point where he couldn't see what I was going through and respond to me empathically. It's devastating that instead of trying to work through his issues and stick with me, knowing how dependant I was upon him at that moment, he headed for the hills instead.
I feel like I was being deprived of a profound connection with a profound person. A window of opportunity was shut down. I don't know when I will be able to open up emotionally to T2... I understand on an intellectual level that it is necessary but right now I'm too wounded to do that and I don't see the end to the aftermath of those events in the near future. A huge, damaging setback.
I looked recently for another therapist as I need more support and T2 lives too far away for me to see her more often than once a week. I don't drive, so I have to rely on my husband for transportation which complicates things. This man, when he heard I was terminated by T1 said that he had many patients coming to him from T1 and never heard any complaints. So now I have insult added to injury. Those who know T1 (and this is a small community) will immediately assume I'm a serious liability or a liar, because I cannot give the reasons for my termination.
This situation made me painfully aware of the inherent power and emotional imbalance in a therapeutical relationship. The client invests him or herself emotionally into someone who is only partly visible to them and available only in a prescribed amount of time for a given amount of money. It puts a client at such risk...
Question mainly for therapists: how often do situations like this occur for Ts - having such a blinding countertransference that the only option left for them is immediate termination? What sort of material can bring about such a strong reaction? T1 is not some second rate hack, who doesn't know how to handle his emotions and I know he has supervision from a very good therapist himself. That makes it all the more scary and unpredictable for me. How many of you clients went through sudden, premature termination without closure because of countertransference issues? How did you cope?
Posted by Annierose on October 4, 2004, at 19:13:48
In reply to In agony over termination (very long!), posted by mandinka on October 4, 2004, at 18:41:51
I just wanted to let you know, I feel for you and the lost of your T. I have never been terminated, but I can only imagine the pain you are experiencing. T2 sounds very emphatic. Too bad she isn't closer to you. It's hard to keep "interviewing" T's, opening up again and again. And what makes you so sure that T1 didn't fall in love with you? If that was the case, he did do the ethical thing if he felt he couldn't work through the countertransferance. Good Luck.
Keep us posted!
Posted by alexandra_k on October 4, 2004, at 19:25:38
In reply to In agony over termination (very long!), posted by mandinka on October 4, 2004, at 18:41:51
Hi there. My heart goes out to you. I have been recently terminated and the reason cited was the t's personal health.
I guess that for me therapy is a kind of re-parenting also. I was unwanted as a kid and neglected because of it and so I have some pretty core beliefs about my being unacceptable and repulsive to others. Therapy is hard for me because I so want to believe that someone can care for me, but when I get terminated it compounds what happened when I was a kid. It takes me longer to trust next time. I start a new therapy relationship with claws out because I am still hurting so bad over past terminations. Maybe I test them by trying to drive them away because then if someone managed to get through that then they would have earned my trust. Aaargh, I am so confused and hurting over this myself.
I hope that you can have a better relationship with a new t. I know that it is hard to trust someone else when one has been hurt. Maybe people who need to be reparented are more likely to produce counter-transference issues. I am sorry, I don't know what else to say.
Posted by mandinka on October 5, 2004, at 0:18:50
In reply to Re: In agony over termination, posted by Annierose on October 4, 2004, at 19:13:48
Thanks for your support, ladies. I'm so happy to read your replies.
I of course thought about the possibility of T1 having a thing for me but it somehow doesn't feel right. He got married not so long ago and my sense was that he's happy with his wife. Also, he said he wouldn't be taking on any new regressive patients and he mentioned, drifting someplace else in his thoughts, that "if he knew a couple of weeks ago what he knew now he would never have taken me onboard". He was saying this in the context of him being ill (which wasn't true as I've already explained) but that part actually felt real. And I know he wasn't thinking about something being very wrong with me. He mentioned before that he was surprised that so much of me was left intact given my history.
When we had the first "goodbye" session (the health issue was still the "reason" for us parting then) and I said I would like to have him as a father, he smiled and said that yes, he'd make a good father "for a girl like you - bright, sensitive, sweet". He said there's an elegance and beauty about me. It didn't sound like infatuation just appreciation... But when we talked last time over the phone (I fought for him to stay with me and pressured him in an email to tell me the truth. That obviously pissed him off) - he stated that he didn't want any relationship with me, he would feel uncomfortable working with me and that we are not right for each other. When I asked quietly "Who's fault is it?" and "What went wrong?" (I was too heartbroken to be angry), he said "What's the difference?" He just didn't want to talk about "us". He said in this half-apologetic tone that I should stay with T2, because she has done a lot of work on herself and is a good person. I agreed with that. Indeed she is empathic and very accepting. We said "Bye" - him smiling with relief, as I recognized by his tone.
He left a message on T2's answering machine that he was terminating the relationship with me. T2 called his therapist/supervisor and said that her client deserves closure. The supervisor replied that she cannot say anything without permission but she does not support me and T1 working together. T1 never called back about the closure issue.
T2 thinks that the problem here is really with T1 not me. She says that she doesn't see anything in me that isn't lovable. Isn't that nice?!
I recently emailed T1 and asked for his opinion about another therapist (T2 couldn't help me here). I also wrote that despite the fact that we haven't spent a lot of time together and there probably isn't much to look at, I'd like to get my records. T1 replied to the recommendation part of the email with one sentence but didn't say anything about the records. I wonder if he'll send them over. If not, at least I'll have a reason to bug him. ;)
Posted by tabitha on October 5, 2004, at 0:53:52
In reply to Re: In agony over termination, posted by mandinka on October 5, 2004, at 0:18:50
Well that's really puzzling. I wonder what motivation he had for not telling you the truth. Did you already try asking T2 if she could get T1 to tell her what really happened? Then maybe T2 could tell you something. Or maybe she could answer the question you posted here about what the reasons might be for T1 keeping you in the dark.
I know that feeling of thinking you'll go nuts if you don't get a reason why someone left. It's a hard fact of life that sometimes you have to get closure on your own, without input from the other party. It does sound like T2 is loyal and is protecting your interests. She sounds like a good resource for helping you through your grief.
You might want to be cautious about continuing to "bug" T1. If he's made it clear he doesn't want contact with you, and you keep contacting him, well I'm worried his responses could get even more hurtful for you. If you want the records, maybe have T2 ask T1 for them instead of contacting him yourself.
Posted by shortelise on October 5, 2004, at 1:36:17
In reply to Re: In agony over termination, posted by mandinka on October 5, 2004, at 0:18:50
It seems really clear to me that this is about him, not about you.
He has issues that are keeping him from being a good therapist for you. Whatever those issues are, you'll never know. From what you write about him, he must have very good reasons for not continuing with you.
I really truly think you are not the reason he sin't continuing with you. I think HE is the reason he is not continuing with you.
If he is as good a therapist you believe he is, then maybe you could try to trust that he has made the best decision for both of you. He surely cares about you, and is trying to limit the damage by ending contact with you - he kows he can't continue to treat you, and is trying his best to end your relationship.
I agree that it would be best to leave him be. If you must have your records, you could send a registered letter requesting they be forwarded wherever you want them. You might want them sent to yor new T, and leave them in her safekeeping.
I feel for you. You must be in terrible pain. What is hardest to imagine is trying to convince that child part of you that this pain is for the best.
And I would guess that your old T is suffering a great deal as well.
Oh, do try to let it go. Try. Try as hard as you know how. No good will come of holding on.
There is a book I like a lot "Necessary Losses" by Judith Viorst. It's an easy read. It might be useful.
This really stinks. It's awful. Be kind to yourself.
ShortE
Posted by Aphrodite on October 5, 2004, at 10:32:22
In reply to In agony over termination (very long!), posted by mandinka on October 4, 2004, at 18:41:51
Oh, what a story! My heart goes out to you! I think what makes it so poignant is that you were doing regressive therapy and had been taken to a vulnerable place and then you had to shut down. It's not like you were doing CBT or other less exposing therapies.
I know it's hard not to take all of this very personally, but as others have said, it is really his issue. I think the only forward and positive thing to do is to try to work out these issues with a new T. It will take you time to trust and feel safe again, and I hope you'll let the new T help you get there.
Keep us updated. This is such a wonderful place for support, so I hope you'll keep posting through this trying time.
Posted by mandinka on October 5, 2004, at 17:45:07
In reply to Re: In agony over termination (very long!) » mandinka, posted by Aphrodite on October 5, 2004, at 10:32:22
I'm so glad I came here. Thanks for the kind words and advice.
I'll behave myself and only ask T1 once more about the files. If he doesn't reply, I'll drop the subject.
T2 knows T1 professionally - they went together through training but they are not close friends, so she cannot just call him up and grill him with impunity (what a pity...). Anyway, she also says T1 is a great guy with a big heart. She feels very sorry for both of us.
It is so sad, when you lose a guy like that. If he was some irresponsible lowlife then it would be so much easier to handle. But the realization that not even the best are immune and can discover after years of work on themselves that they still have blind spots the size of Texas is very discouraging. I hope that one day I'll sit down with him, when he's ready, and we'll talk about what really happened. Maybe later his boundaries will become more permeable and he'll share with me the truth.
Right now I plan on doing an intensive. There is a pair of regressive therapists that has a facility a couple of hours away from where I live, where patients can stay. It will probably be a 6 or 8 day thing of continuous defense dismantling. I'd like to utilize my surplus of pain and vulnerability - it will make me break down more easily. I'll be meeting these guys next Monday and I'll certainly let you know what happened.
Thanks again. You are great.
This is the end of the thread.
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