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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 2, 2011, at 22:52:36
I have a pretty dedicated pdoc. I've been lucky.
He's stuck with me for a long time, even after an overdose earlier this year. It was medication he prescribed, and I don't feel good about that. I never thought I'd do anything like that. I never have done anything like that, anything that might be considered a "suicide attempt". A few weeks before that I had been so upset I felt like I had to do something self destructive, because I had to do something. That really makes no sense. ..and I kept thinking ok, I'll take "this many", because I knew it wasn't going to hurt me really, just enough to knock me out. It felt like there was nothing I could do to deal with the situation.
Those thoughts passed without me acting on them, in part because I thought if you're going to do something stupid don't involve anyone else in it (pdoc, by virtue of the fact that the meds are prescribed)....But then a few weeks later they occurred to me while I was in a bad moment, and I acted on them, with more than that number I had imagined weeks before, but honestly, I think if I had just stopped and had given myself time, I would've been alright, that it would not have become the big deal that it has become. I figured I'd call that f*ck*ng hotline to "just talk". DUI - dialing under the influence
Some pretty severe life stress came before the whole thing, my father has stage 4 cancer, and so I managed to see him after about 20 years of estrangement, and it was extremely painful. It wasn't the only difficult thing in my life at the time, but other things didn't shake me nearly as badly as that.
Since then, I've had my pdoc and my t concerned about me. I don't know how to assure them that I am fine, that nothing like that will ever happen again. I feel guilty about the whole horrible mess.
I told my pdoc that I want to reduce meds soon. It's not that I'm feeling all that great, I'm not really, it's just that I think maybe I have to be honest that my problems are just inherent in me, and that isn't something medication can help.
I don't really want to feel the effects of medication reduction. I don't want to feel anxious, depressed, but I feel like I might be taking advantage of people, behaving the way I have, and failing to "get better".
I don't really want to stop seeing my pdoc, but I do question the meds issue. My pdoc says they're treating something, and I don't want to discount his view, and then I start to wonder...well, maybe he sees something I don't?? He is a pdoc after all, but then I am the one taking the meds, so shouldn't I know myself?
but then I think...it's because he wants to help you, but you can't be helped, so you can't just keep going like this because it's comfortable, it's not right.
My t voices concern about me, but I feel like he's talking about someone else. It feels like that with my pdoc too.
I don't know. There's not necessarily a rush on this, but it feels like an issue now, not sure why??
sometimes I believe that I just pay too much attention to myself, but my head just goes anyway.
ehh....there's no simple answer to this
damn it, I guess sometimes I just think I need to get over myself.
I mean it's nice to feel cared about, but not like this.
Wouldn't you hate to have me as a patient??
Posted by jane d on September 3, 2011, at 16:01:00
In reply to just don't know what to do... *suicide trigger*, posted by sleepygirl2 on September 2, 2011, at 22:52:36
> I told my pdoc that I want to reduce meds soon. It's not that I'm feeling all that great, I'm not really, it's just that I think maybe I have to be honest that my problems are just inherent in me, and that isn't something medication can help.
I'm not sure I agree, but if medication won't help than what will? Do you have something else in mind other than just "sucking it up" ? I'm concerned that this is just a way of you saying "nothing can help me - I'm hopeless" or "I'm just not trying hard enough" . And if it is then you most definitely are not ok. And you more than ever need some kind of help. Probably the medications you want to stop taking. Or different ones.
> ... I feel like I might be taking advantage of people, behaving the way I have, and failing to "get better".
So it's all your fault? Is it everyone's fault who fails to get better? Or just yours? (and mine of course ;-) )
> but then I think...it's because he wants to help you, but you can't be helped, so you can't just keep going like this because it's comfortable, it's not right.
...
> sometimes I believe that I just pay too much attention to myself, but my head just goes anyway.
> ehh....there's no simple answer to this
> damn it, I guess sometimes I just think I need to get over myself.
Excessive guilt?It's not easy figuring out when you need to "get over yourself" and when you really need to take yourself seriously and ask for help. Sometimes I wonder if it's ever possible when you're in the middle of it. I've never really mastered it. To me it sounds as though you are taking way too much responsibility for everything that happened. And I worry that you are doing so not because you are freely choosing responsibility but because you are compelled to do so by some brain mechanism that we don't understand that has run amuck.
I worry that I'm not understanding you the way your pdoc and therapist seem to not understand right now. I hope you'll correct me if I've totally missed the points that are important to you.
Jane
Posted by floatingbridge on September 3, 2011, at 16:02:56
In reply to just don't know what to do... *suicide trigger*, posted by sleepygirl2 on September 2, 2011, at 22:52:36
SG, when you write suicide trigger, are you having urges or ideations?
Would you write back about that?
I am very dull-witted and fumbling for words today. So, my first take is that, on top of feeling poorly, I wonder if you are taking on responsibility for the feelings of others. It's almost a default depressed cognition to feel burdensome. There is also so much crap for lack of a better word coming to mind about suicide attempts and urges and ideations, that they always involve manipulation.
I do not believe you are being manipulative. You are feeling bad. There are people in your life that care, and maybe they want you to care about you and not them. I don't know. But you do have people that care. Right now, don't worry about letting them down. Okay?
I am not worried--I am concerned. I have confidence in you, and that you will be alright....
But check in please.
Warmly and w/ hugs,
the fb'ster
Posted by emmanuel98 on September 3, 2011, at 19:09:38
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do.... » sleepygirl2, posted by floatingbridge on September 3, 2011, at 16:02:56
Don't worry about burdening your p-doc and T. This is their job. This is what they have chosen to do for a living. If you asked them if you were burdening them, I'm sure this is what they would say. They genuinely care about you. My p-doc once said that he was a care-giver by nature and this job allowed him to care for people in a structured and constructive way.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 3, 2011, at 23:55:01
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do... *suicide trigger* » sleepygirl2, posted by jane d on September 3, 2011, at 16:01:00
It's a lot of guilt Jane.
Good question, if not meds then what?
I don't have an answer to that.
Once again, you make a lot of sense. :-)I guess it amounts to 'if I was a better person then I'd feel differently'
I guess I don't buy the chemical imbalance thing, not for myself anyway.
I guess I could explore the possibility of a med change with my Pdoc, find out if it makes a difference.
Thanks Jane :-)
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 0:05:06
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do.... » sleepygirl2, posted by floatingbridge on September 3, 2011, at 16:02:56
Thanks fb :-)
I only put trigger to alert people to content they might rather avoid.
I'm not having any suicidal thoughts. I am trying to tease out what might help me, and what might be more of a search in vain. I just don't know.In the process I just don't want to cause problems for other people. Is that negating their free choice and capacity to decide for themselves? Probably.
I also don't want people to come to the conclusion that I'm not worth helping, so maybe I'll save them the trouble? Maybe it's what they think anyway?Thanks fb,
I suppose I'll try to talk it out.
Take care fb
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 0:07:28
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do...., posted by emmanuel98 on September 3, 2011, at 19:09:38
Thanks emmanuel. I suppose that might be the case.
Maybe they can even take care of themselves??
Take care :-)
Posted by Dinah on September 4, 2011, at 10:52:47
In reply to just don't know what to do... *suicide trigger*, posted by sleepygirl2 on September 2, 2011, at 22:52:36
Your problems might be inherent in you. Mine certainly are me. But medication helps for them, just as it helps for diabetes. My diabetes medication and my psychiatric medication aren't going to cure anything. But they make it possible for me to live as good a life as I can live.
Do your medications do anything? That might be a valid issue. Are these the right medications for you? At least some of the medications I was on helped in some ways, but in other ways exacerbated my core problem.
Do you get the sense that your psychiatrist and therapist understand what's going on with you? When you try to tell them, of course.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 17:01:11
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do... » sleepygirl2, posted by Dinah on September 4, 2011, at 10:52:47
I don't know if they understand. They might think like I do, that my difficulties are a result of my personality and not my biology.
I have to think though that due to it's intensity, my anxiety has a life of it's own, regardless if I recognize it as irrational or dysfunctional.
My life circumstances have got to change. I don't feel like I have much control over a lot of things.
It's very easy to get discouraged if I let myself think about it. I've got to wonder though if I spend too much time thinking
about what I don't have as opposed to appreciating what I do have.
My social anxiety is ridiculous, and it only budges so much.I think I'm trying to figure out what's going on with me so I
might be able to tell them. it's pretty ordinary for me to complain of anxiety, that's just a given
and the medications? Well, I just don't know. Seroquel sedates me, lamictal helps with irritability I suppose, a little klonopin, and effexor
I had another one of those lively deja vu episodes yesterday. Unpleasant.
I'll see what I can see. Lifestyle changes remain necessary. Hoping things will change, but life is what happens while we're busy making other plans,
Thanks Dinah,
sleepy
Posted by sigismund on September 4, 2011, at 17:29:01
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do... » Dinah, posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 17:01:11
Your meds don't work *very* well, it must be fair to say, you say as much yourself.
Perhaps no one knows if you would feel better after a careful reduction, or whether you would not?
I don't know how much control we really have over a great many things.
I was thinking the other day about some awful feeling in me and whether it was due to meds, and I remembered how it has always been like that, more or less, and that nothing was likely to get rid of it. That made me feel a bit better.
Posted by emmanuel98 on September 4, 2011, at 19:13:36
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do.... » emmanuel98, posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 0:07:28
They can take care of themselves. Both my p-doc and T tell me they can't have more than one or two suicidal patients, but they know their limits and how to handle their own practices. I also once apologized to my T for taking her and my p-doc on this rollercoaster ride of my mood swings and she said, we're not on the ride. We're just watching you from the sidelines. On the other hand, my T told me the other day that she has been measuring my progress in the decline in her own level of worry about me.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 22:59:11
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do... » sleepygirl2, posted by sigismund on September 4, 2011, at 17:29:01
> Your meds don't work *very* well, it must be fair to say, you say as much yourself.
>
> Perhaps no one knows if you would feel better after a careful reduction, or whether you would not?and that would be great to know
>
> I don't know how much control we really have over a great many things.isn't that the truth, let me make a list...
nevermind, too many things
>
> I was thinking the other day about some awful feeling in me and whether it was due to meds, and I remembered how it has always been like that, more or less, and that nothing was likely to get rid of it. That made me feel a bit better.yeah, that might help a bit.
I know I've always had emotional/social difficulties... so it's not like they appeared with the medication, but I do sort of wonder...get rid of the meds=get rid of the problem??
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 23:03:16
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do...., posted by emmanuel98 on September 4, 2011, at 19:13:36
I hate worry. I don't want anyone to worry. It's not necessary.
I don't mind concern.
Posted by emmanuel98 on September 4, 2011, at 23:26:02
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do.... » emmanuel98, posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 23:03:16
> I hate worry. I don't want anyone to worry. It's not necessary.
> I don't mind concern.
>
> What's the difference between worry and concern?
>
Posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 23:39:07
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do...., posted by emmanuel98 on September 4, 2011, at 23:26:02
> > I hate worry. I don't want anyone to worry. It's not necessary.
> > I don't mind concern.
> >
> > What's the difference between worry and concern?not sure, but worry sounds like fretting, something anxiety raising
it's all semantics I guess
to me concern is just about paying attention
totally subjective interpretation
Posted by emmanuel98 on September 5, 2011, at 20:26:17
In reply to Re: just don't know what to do.... » emmanuel98, posted by sleepygirl2 on September 4, 2011, at 23:39:07
In that case, I think you should think of your t as concerned. I think most T's are not fretters by nature. They wouldn't be able to do this work if they were. They need to have confidence in their abilities and have enough distance from patient's unhappiness that it doesn't color thier own lives. As I said, both my p-doc and t have told me they know how to manage their practices so their lives aren't upended by patients. Yet they still manage to care and be concerned and take on extra work if a patient needs extra help.
This is the end of the thread.
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