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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 6 of 6. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by judy1 on February 1, 2001, at 20:27:46
I appreciated you effort to understand my reaction. I think anyone on this board who has followed my angst these last few months- the dissociation, the cutting, the depression (and thank God a few days of hypomania) knows what a HUGE issue safety is for me. Because of the support I received with my cutting here, I was able to open up to my shrink about it and get the proper help. A big part of that help involves a therapist who just deals with childhood abuse issues, and we work a lot just making me feel safe. This is tough, tough stuff for me, which may explain why I went off on you. You are so obviously intelligent and write so well, I even quoted a description you wrote of mania to my shrink a while back. I don't remember using the word cruel to you, but if I did I'm sorry. Actually I'm starting to feel guilty about 'obnoxious twit'. Take care, judy
Posted by Mark H. on February 2, 2001, at 15:54:33
In reply to To Mark, posted by judy1 on February 1, 2001, at 20:27:46
Dear Judy,
Thank you for your kind note. My wife is a survivor of horrendous abuse as a child and teenager, and while she is the strongest person I know -- after literally decades of therapy and incredibly hard work applying it in her daily life -- even today when a strange noise wakes her up in the middle of the night, her first reaction frequently is to panic.
I think that the type of therapy that works best for me, and that I sometimes have tried inappropriately to impose on others here, attempts to speak directly and powerfully to the part of us that knows what is right and real for us -- not the "inner child," if you will, but the "inner parent." At those times in my life that I have drifted towards apathy and suicidal depression, someone or some technique has been able to engage the part of me that knows I'm not well and in serious danger. By re-awakening that part, I've been able to change my behavior (to keep it positive and not self-destructive), even though my despair often remained unchanged. I wish I could figure out a way to pass that gift on to others in writing, but so far I haven't done so well with it.
At least twice a year, I go through sustained periods of feeling that my circumstances are truly life-threatening. One of the main things that gets me through those times is comparing my exaggerated feelings with external evidence -- for instance, I've felt this way before, and I've survived; so, is it possible that my feelings of terror and despair are not well founded now? That's one reason why I was splitting the hair of "being safe" versus "feeling safe" with Dr. Bob, because for me it's been a life saver to recognize that important difference. I'm sure you've experienced the same thing and could teach me a few things about it as well.
The biggest difference between therapy and our exchanges here -- and the most disappointing to me -- is that a good therapist ensures the safety of everyone in the room, setting strong boundaries in which all sorts of fears can be experienced and explored, while here we are at best uncertain about where others stand, what values they hold, and what their intentions are.
I have too often proceeded as though that protection was in place and agreed upon here, and sometimes it has backfired. I believe that we really ARE safe here, and (as my therapist says) that "it's OK to think, feel and say anything" since others should be respected to take what is useful and to ignore the rest. But in practice, some people are so exquisitely sensitive that even oblique, ironic or kindly meant criticisms are heard not as respect for their inner strength but as devastating indictments. That's what makes writing so much more difficult for me than personal interaction.
I really appreciate your reaching out to me to help me understand you better. You don't owe me any apologies for anything, but your graciousness moves me anyway. Some of my best friends have started out not liking me at all. I'm glad some people are willing to give me a second chance.
Best wishes,
Mark H.
Posted by Todd on February 2, 2001, at 23:18:17
In reply to Re: To Mark, posted by Mark H. on February 2, 2001, at 15:54:33
Heya, Mark. Once again, you have moved me to write. It's been a while, hasn't it, my soul brother? I may not always write, but I am usually reading what catches my eye. So here's what caught my eye: You spoke of the inner child and the inner parent. I assume that you feel the inner parent is wise and knowing, and that the inner child knows not what is best for him. Correct me if I am wrong, and then I will fill you in on my attitudes. Peace and love.
Todd
Posted by Mark H. on February 5, 2001, at 15:33:43
In reply to Re: To Mark » Mark H., posted by Todd on February 2, 2001, at 23:18:17
Hi Todd,
Wonderful to hear from you again. I didn't mean to imply that the inner parent is *always* knowing and wise while the inner child *always* doesn't know what is best for him, but that for some of us, some of the time, the hurt the inner child carries distorts reality so much that the inner parent must step in to take care of that hurt child, to override the fear and despair with something positive and safe. I can't count the number of times that "parental" part of myself had to make the despairing part of myself go to bed rather than walking all night in the rain, or worse.
I look forward to reading your comments, if you care to share. Now I'm going to read your insights on the wounded healer, another of my favorite topics. Thanks for writing.
Warm regards,
Mark H.
Posted by judy1 on February 5, 2001, at 17:59:05
In reply to Re: Inner Parents and Children, posted by Mark H. on February 5, 2001, at 15:33:43
This sounds an awful lot like my 'dissociative' experiences; basically leaving when I feel threatened or flash on an unacceptable memory. Is this just an extreme example of protecting the 'inner child'? And even more extreme, suspicions of 2 psychologists that I may have DID (psychiatrists seem quite content with bipolar dx)? Or have I gone too far here? Just not all that familiar with psychological expressions - Judy
Posted by Mark H. on February 5, 2001, at 19:47:07
In reply to Re: Inner Parents and Children » Mark H., posted by judy1 on February 5, 2001, at 17:59:05
Judy,
I'm not qualified to say. It could be an extreme example of protecting the "inner child." I've experienced something similar on rare occasions. I remember an instance during college, probably 25 years ago, when I was particularly depressed, and the sound of a vacuum cleaner outside a friend's dorm-room door produced the sensation that I was flying out of my body and out the window. It was very frightening at the time.
It's good to remember that concepts like the "inner child" and "inner parent" are just constructs to make it easier to talk about ourselves, especially when different parts of us hold different values, skills, memories, etc. I think it's important not to make too much of them, though, or we encourage fragmenting, as though we're talking about different people rather than different aspects of ourselves.
One of the most gifted and intelligent therapists I've worked with in the last 20 years uses Transactional Analysis as his primary modality. I don't know how widely used it is today, but it basically acknowledges three main ego states: Parent, Adult, and Child. It recognizes four primary emotions: mad, sad, glad and scared.
By keeping things relatively simple, I found it useful in keeping me from using intellect to obscure what I was working on. How do I feel? Mad, sad, glad or scared? It's easy for me to veer off into ever-more-subtle tangents of emotion, requiring more and more language to describe. Having to select from one of four helped keep me honest with myself, and gave me a place to start.
My references to "inner child" and "inner parent" come from that background in TA. The "inner child" movement in psychological literature arose independently of TA, however. Again, I think it's useful as long as we use it to help ourselves towards wholeness.
I strongly encourage people not to take diagnoses (labels) too seriously. If a diagnosis helps a person get effective treatment, and the treatment alleviates his or her suffering, then that's great. I'm Bipolar II, have refractive (hard-to-treat) depression, and idiopathic hypersomnia (I sleep too much). Knowing about those things and how they are treated led to a medication regimen that works for me.
However, if a diagnosis just puts a fancy, frightening Latin or Greek name to what we experience and causes us (or others) to think less of ourselves, then it adds no value. A friend of mine was recently told she had an "unspecified psychosis," for instance, which understandably upset her. What did it really mean? It meant her doctor had been treating her depression successfully with an anti-psychotic, and when she told him she was planning to move to another state, he quickly added this new "diagnosis" to her chart. She's the same person, before and after diagnosis.
Best wishes,
Mark H.
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