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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by amber_spirit on April 30, 2002, at 16:57:01
I don't know what to do. I don't know whether the
way I'm feeling is the depression and suicidal
thoughts or if I need to find a new pdoc and therapist.
I'm really at the end of my rope (sorry, bad analogy)Background - I'll try to be brief... Episodes of
depression since jr. high. Never got help till
college. Very hard for me to trust, grew up with a
bias again medication of ANY KIND. Finally in college
decided maybe there was some chemical part (duh)
and decided to try medication. Went through about 5
medications and a year and ended up on effexor and
klonopin. Often gave my pdoc a hard time because
whenever something didn't work I felt like nothing
would work and it was a waste of my time. After a
couple of years finally trusted the man.Had to move about 9 months ago. Had done alot in
therapy, feeling good, handling things. Found new
therapist and pdoc here. Different approaches than
what I was used to but seemed ok. About february I
crashed. Major depression and, for the last few(?)
weeks very suicidal. I've really had a hard time
trusting this new pdoc and feel like medication let
me down - I've been doing the work in therapy and
taking my meds and everything just crashed.So, lately I'm very belligerant. Just feel like its
all a waste of time, none of the medications will
help, and pdocs have no logic to their prescribing.
Lately therapist has been making me promise to be
back for the next session and it just makes me so
mad. I feel like the therapy doesn't do anything
right now because I'm so depressed - I just sit
there and cry or explain why I don't want to go on.
I don't know if all of this is because I need
to find a different pdoc and therapist or is just
the fact that I've given up and decided nothing is
going to help. I'm so mad at them for not
understanding that!I don't know what to do. I feel like they just
don't understand.I hope I don't sound too crazy but I don't know
what to do.AS
Posted by paxvox2000 on April 30, 2002, at 18:17:22
In reply to Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by amber_spirit on April 30, 2002, at 16:57:01
Don't ever give up. There is always hope, and always some better treatment available. You have to be patient, however, and try as many docs (GP and Pdoc and OB/GYN) until you find one that listens to you AND seems to care.
Outside of that, try your local support groups. There are MANY, MANY people feeling EXACTLY the way you do (well, maybe not "exactly" exactly). What I mean is that you are NOT ALONE. Sometimes just realizing that can make a tremendous difference from the get go. You can share your feelings, your fears, hopes, dreams etc... Sometimes, just having a "literal" shoulder to cry on is of great help.
Please stick with us! You ARE not alone, nor are you beyond hope or help. That you can even get on the computer to post means that you are able to see there is a problem, and that you WANT to do something to try and resolve it.
Let me know if I can be of anyh assistance.
PAX
Posted by Chris A. on April 30, 2002, at 19:17:09
In reply to Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by amber_spirit on April 30, 2002, at 16:57:01
You could share your post with your pDoc and therapist. If you don't like their reaction you'll know for sure you should fire them.
I am sorry you are feeling so bad. Sometimes when I am doing poorly I feel paranoid about my pDoc and/or therapist. I tend to fire therapists faster than pDocs. I do believe that continuity of care is important for those of us who struggle with serious depression, but a good solid professional relationship with the provider is essential.Blessings,
Chris A.
Posted by judy1 on April 30, 2002, at 20:36:00
In reply to Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by amber_spirit on April 30, 2002, at 16:57:01
Since it's so difficult for you to develope a trusting relationship and you've spent 9 months with your present pdoc and therp, I would try to find a way to work things out than jump to someone new. Being frustrated is normal, and blaming them is common too- they expect it (and is probably why your therp wants to make sure you come in). If you sit there and cry so be it- at least it's with someone who understands. This is a symptom of your depression and will pass, but until then make sure you stick with people who can help and support your current crisis. I wish you well and stay in touch- Judy
Posted by katekite on May 1, 2002, at 14:31:09
In reply to Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by amber_spirit on April 30, 2002, at 16:57:01
Hang in there!
One of the wicked cruel things about depression is the inability to see other people are being nice.... to me, when I'm depressed, they seem like they are just sitting there not caring. That they probably have more important things going on and that they don't understand that I feel as bad as I do. The low self esteem is saying 'why would they care?'. The expressions on their faces seem contrived, almost, but all of that is just (just, hah, its a huge deal) because the interpretation of emotional expression is all screwed up by depression chemistry.
Your considering dumping your therapist and pdoc is most likely a part of depression. If you were gaining trust for them and were at a level of trust a month ago that was good in comparison to when you started then trust that. Unless something big and horrible has actually happened in the office (such as them forgetting show up, or them telling some secret of yours to the papers) then it is most likely the depression doing your feeling for you.
Print out your post and take it in and talk about it.
The fact that they are specifically making sure you promise to be back for your next session shows they are worried about you. Worry = caring. They do care.
If you think they are not aware of quite how depressed you are, that you are having close to intolerable suicidal feelings, then its your job to tell them. One thing that has happened with me in the past is that the morning of a therapy appontment I get up and get going and feel a little better because I have somewhere to go that I think might be helpful, and I try to be proud of myself just for going, and then I get there and have some trouble describing how bad the rest of the previous week was. When I walk out there is a bit of a let down that I don't see them for another week, that I didn't say something, that somehow its over before I started. If that happened in the past, make sure to remind yourself before you go in everytime that it might be a down day afterwards.
The decision over whether a therapist is a good one, only adds to worrying and depression, the 'why bother to go' thoughts.
A rational, logical thing to do would be to set a time limit for getting better with this therapist. Starting now, since you've just barely gotten to trust level. Its individual, but some people say that once you feel comfortable with a therapist you should hope to see some improvement in 4 months, if you are seeing them weekly.
As far as pdocs, that is a little different. All pdocs can make severe depression better because some drug will eventually work. I would stick with them, at least for 3-4 months if you continue to be really depressed, unless they are openly mean or dismissive of how you feel or side effects you are having or can't answer your questions reasonably. Then you would want to get a second opinion, and that is never wrong.
The time to switch pdocs because it isn't working is when they have helped some but can't get any further. Like you are left with a mild depression that won't go away after some months. Right now, the fact that they know you pretty well is probably more important than that this particular drug combo isn't working out so far.
Don't change pdocs at the same time as changing therapists, leave at least 6 months inbetween if you can.
It's normal to be pissed off about medications when they aren't working yet. Try not to generalize to all medications. Its so hard to wait. Every day going to bed wondering if tomorrow will be better or if maybe by some lucky chance a tornado will strike and get you in your sleep to make it stop. This is normal thinking for being depressed but its not really 'normal'.
Suicidal thoughts go against every self-survival mechanism we have as humans. It feels logical, but its not really. Just because other people in history have killed themselves doesn't make it logical, ever. Avoid making any big decisions right now. Wait until at least you don't feel belligerant.
You won't always feel this way. No one ever has who has experienced feeling ok in the past. There are scary stories of people who go through every drug and end up in some institution or with shock therapy, but that's something like 0.001 per cent. If you think its unlikely you'll win the lottery today then you're less likely to end up like that. You're more likely to die first in a car wreck (and don't even think to smile about that possiblity). There is a medication out there that will help, and if not, major depressions tend to last 6 months entirely untreated and then they go away. (which is something that gets in the way of drug trials all the time). Time feels like forever but its absolutely worth it (saying this having spent totals of years of my life really depressed) to wait it out.
Hope today was better than yesterday. Sorry this is so long.
kate
Posted by amber_spirit on May 2, 2002, at 9:47:39
In reply to Re: Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by katekite on May 1, 2002, at 14:31:09
Thanks for all the support and great advice. It helps
to have people that really do understand. Feeling
better today, but it changes from day to day and
even hour to hour. You've given me things to try
though, so I will.AS
Posted by cmcdougall on May 2, 2002, at 13:03:21
In reply to Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by amber_spirit on April 30, 2002, at 16:57:01
Dear Amber,
Please read my post above on subject "Dreading Therapy".
I can't add much to what the others have posted, but I can send good thoughts and prayers....
Have you posted on Psycho-babble? Perhaps your Effexor has pooped-out, or perhaps you need to augment. Unfortunately, major depression can come and go w/ or w/out therapy and meds. Thats why its important to reach out to someone who can understand when you feel yourself crashing. The support found on this board is wonderful. Use us.
Love and luck,
Carly
Posted by Katt on May 2, 2002, at 23:37:49
In reply to Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by amber_spirit on April 30, 2002, at 16:57:01
pdocs just stink in general...
that goes for everyone in the mental health community. they all stink.
Posted by cmcdougall on May 5, 2002, at 18:13:58
In reply to Re: Help... my problems or pdocs, posted by Katt on May 2, 2002, at 23:37:49
> pdocs just stink in general...
> that goes for everyone in the mental health community. they all stink.I suppose I've been lucky. My first pdoc was super. When he retired, I was so worried about finding a replacement. I picked a name out of the phone book and he was super too. I've been seeing my second pdoc for 10 years and don't have a single complaint.
When I was hospitalized last year for Effexor withdrawal, the staff at our local looney bin was also great. Good, caring mental health workers are out there.
Love and luck,
Carly
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