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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by friendofbillw on September 9, 2003, at 20:44:40
Happy to see this new board Dr. Bob.
I've been in recovery for 4 years. I relapsed on June 6 2003 after taking phentermine for weight loss. I started out being controlled and felt great. I felt focused and invigorated, but eventually went to abusing the phentermine and then wanted beer to calm down. It was a one night binge, but could have led to loss of my job. I drank at work! Yes, right back into trouble. Anyway, I'm back on track and am wishing there was something safe for my ADD.
I was put on celexa when in treatment and didn't have any side effects. My doc seems to think I'm depressed and that maybe celexa "pooped out," so I've switched to lexapro 5 days ago. I take at night, like I did celexa, because it makes me tired, but other than that, no side effects.
I'm reading up on going to OA to deal with my food issues, but sure wish that there was something for my ADD that wouldn't lead me back to abusive behavior with alcohol and drugs. Anyone have any luck with anything that helps with ADD? I hate how I can't stay on task and seem so day-dreamy and unable to complete anything. It's very frustrating to be highly impulsive, yet dealing with food and alcohol addiction. Ugh! I should say I'm successful in my career, but it's a challenge.
Thanks for your time and for reading my long post. Looking forward to your sharing.
Posted by Arrianna on September 10, 2003, at 12:58:04
In reply to Addiction Adult ADD, posted by friendofbillw on September 9, 2003, at 20:44:40
Glad that you were able to get back on track so quickly regarding your relapse. Good for you!
This is a tough one. Sorry, I don't know what works for ADD. Is that what you're taking the Lex for? Maybe I should read your post again.
Anyways, I've been on 10mg Lex for a little over 2 months. First AD ever, and it's working great for me. On it for anxiety and depression. But, I probably got some ADD, too. Lord knows, I could have just about everything.
Hopefully you'll find answers from others who are or have experienced ADD.
Just really wanted to give you credit for getting back into recovery! I also relapsed a couple of weeks ago. Been in recovery since '95. Thankfully, it only lasted one weekend. It's so scary how the disease can progress so rapidly and present itself at any given moment.
Trying to look at my relapse as a blessing in disquise, and to discover what was going on that I relapsed, and then to work to change that.
Wishing the best for you! Hope you find the answers you're looking for! Hang in there. This too shall pass.
Also a friend of BillW's,
Arrianna
Posted by friendofbillw on September 10, 2003, at 19:25:43
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD » friendofbillw, posted by Arrianna on September 10, 2003, at 12:58:04
>Arriana, thanks for the reply. Glad to hear you are on track again too. I do feel pretty good about my relapse too. It was horrible and I'm glad for that. The days of enjoying a beer are so long over and being reminded was actually helpful. I do have a sponsor now too. Duh.
To answer your questions, I was given Celexa in treatment (almost 4 years ago). At the time, just accepted that I've probably been somewhat depressed all my life and self-medicating, so I'm sticking with it. I changed to LEX just because my doc thought that after 4 years the celexa may have "pooped out."
I'm looking for something to help with ADD but won't trigger me into drug seeking behavior over speed, which I like. Maybe that doesn't exist, but I thought I'd put it out there.
Take care, see you in the chats!
Lisa
Posted by Festus on September 10, 2003, at 22:34:37
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD » Arrianna, posted by friendofbillw on September 10, 2003, at 19:25:43
They say the newer ADD drug Strattera is doing a good job replacing stimulants.Festus
Posted by Arrianna on September 12, 2003, at 16:11:44
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD » Arrianna, posted by friendofbillw on September 10, 2003, at 19:25:43
Lisa,
Hi. Good job on getting a sponsor! That's what I need to do, too. Haven't got one yet, but will work on it.
How's the lex working for you? Have you found anything for ADD? Just wondering: have you talked to your doc. about it?
How's recovery going for you? I still want to drink! It's crazy, because it always leads to self-destruction for myself, yet I think I could just have a few drinks. Yeah, right. It would be nice just to have a couple, but it hardly ever ends there. Should probably hit a few more 1st step meetings.
Anyway, hope things are going well!!!
Keep in touch,
Arrianna
Posted by friendofbillw on September 12, 2003, at 19:03:21
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD » friendofbillw, posted by Arrianna on September 12, 2003, at 16:11:44
Lex is pretty good, as far as I can tell. NO side effects equals good to me. I do take it at night because of the potential for sleepiness. I haven't done anymore on the add stuff. I really think that a commitment to exercise would help relieve some of the distractions. It's been proven to help, so given my drug-laced history I think I'll suck it up and do that. Thanks for asking.
Have you heard that alcoholISM stands for I Sponsor Myself ISM... Thought that was funny. That's what I did and now that I found a wonderful woman friend to help, it's so much easier. It's tough, I think, to find someone to be your sponsor, but now that I have one, well worth it.
You?
> Lisa,
>
> Hi. Good job on getting a sponsor! That's what I need to do, too. Haven't got one yet, but will work on it.
>
> How's the lex working for you? Have you found anything for ADD? Just wondering: have you talked to your doc. about it?
>
> How's recovery going for you? I still want to drink! It's crazy, because it always leads to self-destruction for myself, yet I think I could just have a few drinks. Yeah, right. It would be nice just to have a couple, but it hardly ever ends there. Should probably hit a few more 1st step meetings.
>
> Anyway, hope things are going well!!!
> Keep in touch,
> Arrianna
Posted by Arrianna on September 13, 2003, at 16:31:05
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD, posted by friendofbillw on September 12, 2003, at 19:03:21
>> Have you heard that alcoholISM stands for I Sponsor Myself ISM... Thought that was funny. > >
May have heard that a few times? Hear alot of great things in the program. It is funny, yet so true: ISM. Yeah, I have been trying to sponsor myself and doing things as much on my own as possible. The ISM is a great point!!
No side effects for you on Lex?? That is great! You are lucky. I had quite a few the first few weeks. Ick. Thankfully, they've all settled now and I have begun to experience the therapeutic benefits of the med.
I think that the excercize thing is a great idea!! I'm a true believer in excercise and it's benefits. Try to work out between 3-4x/week. It takes alot of discipline, yet is so worth it!! I always leave the gym feeling 100% better. I love what it does for me health wise, and what is does for my appearance is just an added bonus. So, wish you the best with it. You can do it! Like you said, just suck it up and stick with it. It'll get easier once you start noticing the beneficial results.
Good Luck and keep postin',
Arrianna
> > Hi. Good job on getting a sponsor! That's what I need to do, too. Haven't got one yet, but will work on it.
> >
> > How's the lex working for you? Have you found anything for ADD? Just wondering: have you talked to your doc. about it?
> >
> > How's recovery going for you? I still want to drink! It's crazy, because it always leads to self-destruction for myself, yet I think I could just have a few drinks. Yeah, right. It would be nice just to have a couple, but it hardly ever ends there. Should probably hit a few more 1st step meetings.
> >
> > Anyway, hope things are going well!!!
> > Keep in touch,
> > Arrianna
>
>
Posted by friendofbillw on September 16, 2003, at 19:53:36
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD, posted by Arrianna on September 13, 2003, at 16:31:05
Just saw this in the paper and this may help all of us...
Adults with ADHD now have new treatment
Donna Halvorsen, Star Tribune
Published September 16, 2003 HALV16Robin Kemp saw herself as bright and capable, and although it took a long time, she pushed herself through college. Then she landed a plum job as a writer for CNN in Atlanta, where she lives.
But life was difficult, and she knew something was wrong. She was messy and disorganized, unable to create and maintain any real order in her life. She had a tendency to break into conversations while someone else was talking, making her seem pushy and obnoxious. She couldn't focus or follow through on tasks. She had little self-esteem.
Still, she enrolled in graduate school, and shortly after she received a master's degree, a psychiatrist told her: "I think there's a chance that you have attention deficit disorder."
"I just lit up like a Christmas tree," she said. "I said, 'That's it!' All of the little pieces fell together, and there's so many of these little pieces."
Since March Kemp has been taking Strattera, a new prescription drug for adults with attention deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), a condition once thought to affect only children.
After only a few months on the drug, she said she's making "really good and rapid progress."
Others aren't so lucky. Researchers estimate that nearly 8 million adults in the United States have ADHD, but many don't know it. Unaware of their condition and untreated, they lack an explanation for the difficulties in their lives.
The U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved Strattera last year as the first non-stimulant for ADHD. It's also the first new drug approved to treat ADHD in 30 years, according to the FDA. Physicians wrote $1.2 million worth of prescriptions for it in its first six months on the market, according to Eli Lilly & Company, its maker.
Despite its dramatic surge in sales, Strattera is not a cure-all, but rather an alternative to widely used stimulant drugs, according to ADHD experts.
"It's the new kid on the block and everybody wants to try it," said Dr. George Realmuto, associate professor of psychiatry at the University of Minnesota. But, he said, "it doesn't have as robust an effect and will not be as effective in as wide a group as the standard drugs."
Realmuto said Strattera can be a good medication for ADHD patients who also are substance abusers. He said some patients have doubled or tripled their doses of ADHD stimulant medications to get high. Strattera is not a stimulant or a controlled substance.
Dr. Gerald August, interim director of child and adolescent psychiatric services at Fairview-University Medical Center in Minneapolis, said there is no evidence yet that Strattera is more effective than existing ADHD drugs, which include Ritalin, Adderall, Concerta, Metadate, Dextrostat and Dexedrine, all brain stimulants and controlled substances.
Mark, who asked that his real name not be used to protect his privacy, is a medical researcher in his 50s who lives in Plymouth. He said Ritalin has helped his ADHD for more than a decade. Before he began taking the drug, he was easily frustrated and angered, and could work at his desk only a few minutes before he had to get up and do something else. Ritalin calms his restlessness and allows him to focus on tasks, he said, and he has had no side effects.
Only Mark's immediate family knows that he has ADHD. "It's not a secret so much as a nonissue with me," he said. "It's not something you talk about."
It's not known exactly how Strattera works, but in six clinical trials, it significantly reduced ADHD symptoms, according to Lilly. The most common side effects in adults were constipation, dry mouth, nausea, decreased appetite, dizziness, problems sleeping, sexual side effects, problems urinating and menstrual cramps. But most people were not bothered enough by the side effects to stop using the drug, Lilly said.
'Misunderstood' problem
One of the difficulties for adult patients is that ADHD is "misunderstood and is frankly thought to be a fabrication by some people, including physicians," said Dr. Bill Nelson, a Crystal psychiatrist who specializes in treating adults with ADHD.
An ADHD-like disorder was known to be a problem in children a century ago, but it wasn't until the 1970s that ADHD was known to persist into adulthood, said Dr. Lenard Adler, head of the adult ADHD program in the Department of Psychiatry and Neurology at New York University (NYU).
"Somehow it was supposed to magically go away as kids went through adolescence, which didn't make a lot of sense, actually," Adler said. "If it's a neurological disorder, why is it all of a sudden going away? It turns out that probably 60 percent of kids who have ADHD go on to be adults with ADHD, which means that about 4 percent of the American population probably has ADHD."
It wasn't until the 1980s, after diagnostic criteria had been developed, that psychiatrists could diagnose the disorder in adults. More than two decades later, many adults still don't seek help. And if they did, they might not receive ADHD diagnoses. In a NYU survey, 92 percent of 400 primary care doctors said they felt "very" or "extremely" knowledgeable in treating depression, compared with 34 percent in treating ADHD.
Although Strattera is the first ADHD medication tailored specifically to adults, children and adolescents can take it, too. It requires one daily pill.
Adults with ADHD, however, have symptoms different from those of children. The running and climbing that are characteristic of children with ADHD become "a sense of internal restlessness as adults," Adler said. Adults "know it's not appropriate to climb on top of their desks."
He added, "Successful adults may have not only Palm Pilots but also an executive assistant to help them organize. They may select active careers where they have an outlet for some of their restlessness. They have trouble waiting, so they try to have control of their day so they don't have to be in situations where they have to wait."
Adler said the consequences of not diagnosing ADHD in adults and treating it are significant: They're more likely to be separated or divorced, to underperform on the job or change jobs more frequently, to abuse substances, to have more motor vehicle accidents and tickets.
For an ADHD diagnosis, the patient must display multiple, enduring symptoms that have caused trouble in the patient's life, and the symptoms must date to childhood.
Kemp said she can date her symptoms to seventh grade, when she got D's and F's instead of the A's she was capable of getting. She is not one to look back, but wonders if she would have been a tenured professor by now or if she would have gone to medical school, "which is what I thought I was going to do."
Kemp left CNN to go to graduate school. Now she's a poet who also teaches poetry and is happy about her life. She appeals to the public to understand a little-known adult disorder that can be so damaging to otherwise capable, healthy people.
"People need to understand that this is not a failure of character or laziness, because it comes off that way; it does look like that," she said.
Strattera is not a cure-all, Kemp said, but it has allowed her to follow through on tasks needed to function in everyday life.
"It's helped me to be my best self," she said.
Posted by Arrianna on September 17, 2003, at 9:46:16
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD-new article, posted by friendofbillw on September 16, 2003, at 19:53:36
Lisa,
What a great article! Thanks for putting so much time into copying it for others to benefit. It offered myself insight into something I wasn't really aware about.
Also sounds like you found the article at the perfect time for yourself; just when you were looking for answers. That's great!!
Anyway, I noticed the article was from the Star Tribune, so I am assuming that you are from the Minneapolis area???? I live in Eagan, right outside of Minneapolis, so I just thought it'd be cool if you lived around here, too. Haven't met anyone in the "posts" from my area.
Thanks again for the article!! Take care and let us know how you're doing, okay?
Arrianna
Posted by friendofbillw on September 17, 2003, at 21:55:24
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD-new article » friendofbillw, posted by Arrianna on September 17, 2003, at 9:46:16
Yes, I'm from MSP.
Here's my website, www.serenityvacations.com
drop me an email.
Posted by Peter N on September 23, 2003, at 10:25:42
In reply to Addiction Adult ADD, posted by friendofbillw on September 9, 2003, at 20:44:40
I just went through drug rehab where my disorder was diagnosed for the first time. The diagnosis was made primarily through interviews with my parents. I was good at school, so it was never investigated in my youth. However, when I got to college and had to structure my own time, my life fell apart. I struggled through 3 years of college, felt completely overwhelmed and dropped out. I felt worthless, so it didn't even scare me to allow myself to become dependent on drugs and alcohol. My friends would say "I think you might have a problem," and I would reply "So?" I looked at my life in terms of my poor performance in college and figured it wasn't worth preserving.
After the diagnosis was made, however, I was prescribed Strattera in addition to the Wellbutrin I had been taking. The combination worked surprisingly well for my ADD and pulled me out of a state which I had considered normal from which drugs provided me a temporary reprieve.
Now I find my symptoms are best controlled with the two medications, proper diet, regular exercizel, and a regular sleeping schedule along with organization techniques I picked up from ADD self-help literature.
Good luck, and congradulations on being sober for 4 years. Without the clarity I experienced with the Strattera, I don't think my recovery would have been possible. This is an example of "grave emotional and mental disorders" that weren't well-understood in 1939, but can now be treated with medication that has little potential for abuse.
Posted by friendofbillw on September 23, 2003, at 21:06:28
In reply to Re: Addiction Adult ADD, posted by Peter N on September 23, 2003, at 10:25:42
Thanks for the great info! I too found out about my ADD in treatment as well. It was a real "a-ha" moment for me. Celexa was given to me in treatment and I doubt I could have handled the first year of sobriety without it.
Best wishes on your success. And remember...sobriety is like two lives in one lifetime. Congratulations and thanks for the info.
\> I just went through drug rehab where my disorder was diagnosed for the first time. The diagnosis was made primarily through interviews with my parents. I was good at school, so it was never investigated in my youth. However, when I got to college and had to structure my own time, my life fell apart. I struggled through 3 years of college, felt completely overwhelmed and dropped out. I felt worthless, so it didn't even scare me to allow myself to become dependent on drugs and alcohol. My friends would say "I think you might have a problem," and I would reply "So?" I looked at my life in terms of my poor performance in college and figured it wasn't worth preserving.
>
> After the diagnosis was made, however, I was prescribed Strattera in addition to the Wellbutrin I had been taking. The combination worked surprisingly well for my ADD and pulled me out of a state which I had considered normal from which drugs provided me a temporary reprieve.
>
> Now I find my symptoms are best controlled with the two medications, proper diet, regular exercizel, and a regular sleeping schedule along with organization techniques I picked up from ADD self-help literature.
>
> Good luck, and congradulations on being sober for 4 years. Without the clarity I experienced with the Strattera, I don't think my recovery would have been possible. This is an example of "grave emotional and mental disorders" that weren't well-understood in 1939, but can now be treated with medication that has little potential for abuse.
This is the end of the thread.
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