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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 10:05:14
My problem isn't the Adderall crashing after a few days, my problem is the HORRIBLE dysphoria every evening when I come down from my day-long hypomanic high. Does this happen to everyone or am I on the wrong medication? How can anyone stand these HORRID crashes on a daily basis. I almost killed myself last night. Comming down from this stuff is NOT FUN. Supposedly I'm ADD, but there's a bipolar-type component to my problem as well. I take 2000mg Neurontin a day. with 10 mg Prozac. Maybe it's not enough.
Posted by mr.scott on January 28, 2002, at 13:06:46
In reply to Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 10:05:14
> My problem isn't the Adderall crashing after a few days, my problem is the HORRIBLE dysphoria every evening when I come down from my day-long hypomanic high. Does this happen to everyone or am I on the wrong medication? How can anyone stand these HORRID crashes on a daily basis. I almost killed myself last night. Comming down from this stuff is NOT FUN. Supposedly I'm ADD, but there's a bipolar-type component to my problem as well. I take 2000mg Neurontin a day. with 10 mg Prozac. Maybe it's not enough.
Yes, I too had the crashes. Tried all kind of the stims long acting, short acting, intermediate acting...
I stated it in an earlier post, but hands down the similarity between your response to various drugs and mine is uncanny. I too have the same diagnostic confusion surrounding me, and the same response to Stimulants as you. The part where we go seperate ways is on the RLS, although for months I was spaz on Prozac with restlessness in general. My opinion, which I believe is fairly well thought out but still just my opinion, is that BP 2 sounds closer than ADD. I'm betting the stims won't work for you. So far I find a bit of AD + mood stabilizer or a soothing drug like klonopin is required for my often agitated/anxious/dysphoric/depressed brain state. Depakote works, but a price must be paid for it. One that I'm trying to avoid right now and find a more friendly drug. Hence my interest in your trileptal trial. Have you tried Klonopin? I vaguely remember thinking so, but I may be confused. If so what is your experience there.
My mood is like a buzz saw caked with dirt and grime & motor oil that spews noxious exhaust. AKA a Dark & agitating and its often expressed in my behavior and conversation.
Scott
Posted by kiddo on January 28, 2002, at 14:13:55
In reply to Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 10:05:14
Have you checked in to Adderall XR...it spreads out the dosage, releasing some of the med in the morning and then again in the afternoon.
I'm trying that version this month.
Kiddo> My problem isn't the Adderall crashing after a few days, my problem is the HORRIBLE dysphoria every evening when I come down from my day-long hypomanic high. Does this happen to everyone or am I on the wrong medication? How can anyone stand these HORRID crashes on a daily basis. I almost killed myself last night. Comming down from this stuff is NOT FUN. Supposedly I'm ADD, but there's a bipolar-type component to my problem as well. I take 2000mg Neurontin a day. with 10 mg Prozac. Maybe it's not enough.
Posted by Darby on January 28, 2002, at 15:39:02
In reply to Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 10:05:14
MB--
What's your dose of Adderall? And how often do you take it during the day? Your comment about "hypomanic high" suggests the dose my be too high or stimulants aren't an appropriate med for your condition.My best,
Darby
Posted by alley on January 28, 2002, at 18:40:48
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes » MB, posted by kiddo on January 28, 2002, at 14:13:55
im curious if anyone has taken adderall with topamax...my pdoc just started me on this combo...well its in effect for tomorrow...100mg topamax at night and 30mg adderal extended release in the morning...if anyone has any feedback id be of help..thanks..
> Have you checked in to Adderall XR...it spreads out the dosage, releasing some of the med in the morning and then again in the afternoon.
>
> I'm trying that version this month.
>
>
> Kiddo
>
>
>
>
>
> > My problem isn't the Adderall crashing after a few days, my problem is the HORRIBLE dysphoria every evening when I come down from my day-long hypomanic high. Does this happen to everyone or am I on the wrong medication? How can anyone stand these HORRID crashes on a daily basis. I almost killed myself last night. Comming down from this stuff is NOT FUN. Supposedly I'm ADD, but there's a bipolar-type component to my problem as well. I take 2000mg Neurontin a day. with 10 mg Prozac. Maybe it's not enough.
Posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 22:07:00
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes » MB, posted by mr.scott on January 28, 2002, at 13:06:46
> Yes, I too had the crashes. Tried all kind of the stims long acting, short acting, intermediate acting...
>
> I stated it in an earlier post, but hands down the similarity between your response to various drugs and mine is uncanny. I too have the same diagnostic confusion surrounding me, and the same response to Stimulants as you. The part where we go seperate ways is on the RLS, although for months I was spaz on Prozac with restlessness in general. My opinion, which I believe is fairly well thought out but still just my opinion, is that BP 2 sounds closer than ADD. I'm betting the stims won't work for you. So far I find a bit of AD + mood stabilizer or a soothing drug like klonopin is required for my often agitated/anxious/dysphoric/depressed brain state. Depakote works, but a price must be paid for it. One that I'm trying to avoid right now and find a more friendly drug. Hence my interest in your trileptal trial. Have you tried Klonopin? I vaguely remember thinking so, but I may be confused. If so what is your experience there.Trileptal made me feel yucky and made me feel like my liver was going to explode (chills, tremors, fatigue, etc). right now I'm on 2000mg Neurontin a day and approx 2.5 mg Klonopin/day. My pdoc told me tonight that he thinks I'm bipolar but that i also have ADD. I imagine this is a very tough combo to treat. My Adderall dose has been dropped from 5mg bid to 2.5mg bid. We're preceding cautiously. I am switching my AD from Prozac to Serzone hopefully to get rid of the RLS and anorgasmia. So what *is* the price to be paid for the Depakote? Are you talking about the weight gain issue? I just recently found out that one of the most beautiful women I've ever known has been on Depakote since the age of sixteen (and trust me, she is *not* overweight). It just goes to show you...ymmv...
MB
Posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 22:09:51
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes » MB, posted by kiddo on January 28, 2002, at 14:13:55
> Have you checked in to Adderall XR...it spreads out the dosage, releasing some of the med in the morning and then again in the afternoon.
>
> I'm trying that version this month.
>
>
> Kiddo
My pdoc did mention the xr version tonight. We switched ADs today and I don't think he wanted to make too many changes at once. Plus, I'm on such a low dose of Adderall at the moment, I would probably need to titrate up a little before trying the XR version.MB
Posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 22:12:34
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by Darby on January 28, 2002, at 15:39:02
> MB--
> What's your dose of Adderall? And how often do you take it during the day? Your comment about "hypomanic high" suggests the dose my be too high or stimulants aren't an appropriate med for your condition.
>
> My best,
>
> Darby
Pdoc said tonight that an *energy* crash in the evening was normal, but that a crash into serious *dysphoria* was more indicative of bipolar disorder. He thinks it is looking more like this is a component to my problem. This complicates things, but I think he is very smart, and I have faith that eventually...MB
Posted by Darby on January 29, 2002, at 18:51:53
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes » Darby, posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 22:12:34
MB --
Yes, definitely work with your MD. It may take a while to fine tune. Wellbutrin is a great option because of lack of sexual side effects, efficacious for ADD and sometimes bipolar. Keep Klonopin pm for RLS/sleep.
If you stay with stimulants, be sure to try dexedrine (different formulation than Adderall)and Ritalin. All 3 have very different impact -- you may find that one of these others is smoother for you and less likely to cause crash/dysphoria. Cylert might be ok as last resort. Problem with amphet/Adderall/ritalin stimulants is they tend to be so blunt -- quick into the system, quick out. When taken with another med/AD, very small dose am seems to work best and minimizes crashing. Another option might be a longer-acting dopaminergic like selegeline or bromocriptine or amantadine which acts more smoothly throughout the day. Small subtheraputic
doses usually work well with an AD.Best,
Darby
Posted by MB on January 30, 2002, at 3:51:59
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by Darby on January 29, 2002, at 18:51:53
> MB --
>
> Yes, definitely work with your MD. It may take a while to fine tune. Wellbutrin is a great option because of lack of sexual side effects, efficacious for ADD and sometimes bipolar. Keep Klonopin pm for RLS/sleep.
>
> If you stay with stimulants, be sure to try dexedrine (different formulation than Adderall)and Ritalin. All 3 have very different impact -- you may find that one of these others is smoother for you and less likely to cause crash/dysphoria. Cylert might be ok as last resort. Problem with amphet/Adderall/ritalin stimulants is they tend to be so blunt -- quick into the system, quick out. When taken with another med/AD, very small dose am seems to work best and minimizes crashing. Another option might be a longer-acting dopaminergic like selegeline or bromocriptine or amantadine which acts more smoothly throughout the day. Small subtheraputic
> doses usually work well with an AD.
>
> Best,
>
> DarbyMy pdoc suggested Adderall XR. They used to make a Desoxyn XR but they stopped. He said that he thought the Desoxyn XR was the best...bummed that it was discontinued.
Posted by Rakken on January 30, 2002, at 12:56:38
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by MB on January 30, 2002, at 3:51:59
The crash could go away as your tolerance increases. Or you might try experimenting with the dose. Try 2/3 of what your taking or maybe 1/2. It's potent stuff after all (as long as you haven't developed tolerance too much). I remember when I was first on Dexedrine. I crashed very hard one day and felt like I had taken a muscle relaxant. I tried to enjoy it in a weird kind of way, but the dysphoria made it hard. I got used to the Dexedrine pretty quickly. And many people think it is smoother than Adderall in some ways (like the up). Maybe you'd have less of a crash if you tried it for a week or two. Give it time though.
Posted by MB on January 31, 2002, at 2:24:11
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by Rakken on January 30, 2002, at 12:56:38
> The crash could go away as your tolerance increases. Or you might try experimenting with the dose. Try 2/3 of what your taking or maybe 1/2. It's potent stuff after all (as long as you haven't developed tolerance too much). I remember when I was first on Dexedrine. I crashed very hard one day and felt like I had taken a muscle relaxant. I tried to enjoy it in a weird kind of way, but the dysphoria made it hard. I got used to the Dexedrine pretty quickly. And many people think it is smoother than Adderall in some ways (like the up). Maybe you'd have less of a crash if you tried it for a week or two. Give it time though.
Yeah, I'm bad about giving drugs "time," or, more accurately, giving my body time to adjust. I want to feel better NOW. Its hard to wait when you're suffering.MB
ps. the pdoc mentioned either Dexedrine or Desoxyn if if the Adderall keeps making me too nervous. There's l-amphetamine in the Adderall. I don't know how that affects the subjective feeling of the drug. However, the three types of salts (saccharate, sulfate, and aspartate) are supposed to make the "come on" and "come off" less severe...i dunno, maybe each salt hits at different times, or whatever. I would like to know what the levo-amphetamine is doing to me...is it more anxiogenic?
MB
Posted by benzapp on February 1, 2002, at 17:34:52
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by MB on January 30, 2002, at 3:51:59
Yeah its too bad... Methylized organic chemicals are generally far superior to the others. If only the government understood the only reason it is a popular street drug is it is so easy to convert over the counter sudafed into methamphetamine.
> > MB --
> >
> > Yes, definitely work with your MD. It may take a while to fine tune. Wellbutrin is a great option because of lack of sexual side effects, efficacious for ADD and sometimes bipolar. Keep Klonopin pm for RLS/sleep.
> >
> > If you stay with stimulants, be sure to try dexedrine (different formulation than Adderall)and Ritalin. All 3 have very different impact -- you may find that one of these others is smoother for you and less likely to cause crash/dysphoria. Cylert might be ok as last resort. Problem with amphet/Adderall/ritalin stimulants is they tend to be so blunt -- quick into the system, quick out. When taken with another med/AD, very small dose am seems to work best and minimizes crashing. Another option might be a longer-acting dopaminergic like selegeline or bromocriptine or amantadine which acts more smoothly throughout the day. Small subtheraputic
> > doses usually work well with an AD.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Darby
>
> My pdoc suggested Adderall XR. They used to make a Desoxyn XR but they stopped. He said that he thought the Desoxyn XR was the best...bummed that it was discontinued.
Posted by TXRN1 on February 4, 2002, at 23:11:43
In reply to Re: Daily Adderall Crashes » MB, posted by mr.scott on January 28, 2002, at 13:06:46
Try Adderal XR. It lasts all day and it doesn't have that "crash" in between doses. I used to take 80mg of Adderal per day. and now my dose is only 60mg. This is a WAY big improvement.
Posted by Jay Beck on June 3, 2003, at 11:14:26
In reply to Daily Adderall Crashes, posted by MB on January 28, 2002, at 10:05:14
i have the same kind of crash, i actually feel normal in the day after my adderal XR and when it crashes i feel like garbage. my current meds are
Lexapro 10mg
Adderal XR 20mg
Sam-e 200mgmy guess for the crash is the loss of dopamine. Adderal can easaly deplete your dopamine and you will then become deppressed after crashing. I take Sam-e to some what counteract this loss of nuerotransmiters. Although i usualy crash if i abuse rather then use Adderal. If i take my 20mg in the morn i get slightly deppresed/anxious at the crash if i snort a few the crash is HORRIBLE. thats why i stopped abusing them.
just my thoughts
This is the end of the thread.
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