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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
What is it?
Are they a viable option for someone long term?
Do they cause depenance?
Do you build tolerance?Appreciate all opinions.
I am talking about dexis, adderall, concerta, ritalin etc..Thanks,
Huxley
Posted by Christ_empowered on December 11, 2011, at 4:43:34
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
I'd just try to keep the dose reasonably low and take brief breaks (say, weekends) and then consider taking longer periods off, such as Holidays.
For depression, I've heard that they're not a good solo option. Then again, they're used in tired, depressed elderly and sick people as monotherapy, so it can't be that bad. Just watch out for dosage escalation and keep your expectations reasonable (by reasonable, I mean relatively low--there's only so much an upper can do).
Posted by creepy on December 11, 2011, at 8:27:13
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
For attention issues and OCD they seem to help out. For other issues like energy, weight loss and depression theyre not used much because tolerance develops.
Posted by Phillipa on December 11, 2011, at 10:19:47
In reply to Re: The Truth about Stimulants, posted by creepy on December 11, 2011, at 8:27:13
Why does tolerance develop for them for some issues and not others? Still don't see how if OCD is an anxiety disorder how they help as they stimulate. Wasn't that what providgil was developed for? But even tolerance develops on that? Phillipa
Posted by Sailboat77 on December 11, 2011, at 14:13:43
In reply to Re: The Truth about Stimulants » creepy, posted by Phillipa on December 11, 2011, at 10:19:47
I have a pretty long history with stimulants: Adderall, Vyvanse, Dexadrine-Amphetamine (i.e. Instant release Adderall). I had problems with tolerance, especially when the dosage was high. My doctor explained it well in that some people have a chemical makeup that genuinely lacks the natural ability to produce the chemicals needed to pay attention, so those sort of people don't grow as much of a tolerance. Others don't have that natural deficiency, so their body's grow tolerant to the excessive flood of chemicals which are throwing off the body's equilibrium.
Sometimes, but not always, the best way to approach stimulants is to take it every other day or in limited quantity. Again, every body has a different chemical makeup so one person may grow tolerant where another person might not.
-Best of luck
Posted by bleauberry on December 11, 2011, at 15:04:41
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
The stimulants can be particularly helpful for a subset of people, but it seems to me that is usually when it is combined with a ssri...prozac and zoloft best choices here...and/or a tca.
My own experience shows there is no way to predict anything you just have to basically experiment to see what happens. For example ritalin was immediately mood lifting, energy boosting, and concentration boosting, while adderall caused sudden glooming heavy depression.
My favorite stimulant lasted about 8 years and that was adrafinil in combination with ssri. So if you are looking at that route you might want to include modafinil and adrafinil on the list.
The best I've found is actually an herb not a med.
Once in a while a particularly heavy bad day needs an emergency blanket and that's when I use a ritalin.
The strangest thing though, if I take too much I get depressed, not enough I can't feel it, but regardless of how the day goes, the next day without it is unusually better than recently. I don't know whether the single dose somehow temporary resets some receptors or something. I noticed the same thing with vicadin...didn't matter what happened the day I took it, the next day was a good day. But if I take it every day, all the good is lost and it becomes mean instead. Like I said I think they need ssri companionship to work right. Except for the herb which seems to do good for a lot stuff all by itself.
Posted by Emme-V2 on December 11, 2011, at 15:22:45
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
> What is it?
> Are they a viable option for someone long term?
> Do they cause depenance?
> Do you build tolerance?
>
> Appreciate all opinions.
> I am talking about dexis, adderall, concerta, ritalin etc..
>
> Thanks,
>
> Huxley
>Hi. I've taken a low dose of focalin for several years. It is related to Ritalin (one of the isomers). It does not improve my depression by itself. But it helps with some of the leftover lethargy once my mood is reasonable. I do find it helpful. I have not had a hint of either tolerance or dependence. I am quite sensitive to medications, so I get by with 1.25 mg once or twice a day. The trick I think it to titrate your dose carefully upwards to find the dose that gets the job done without making you too jittery.
Good luck.
emme
Posted by Sailboat77 on December 11, 2011, at 16:09:55
In reply to Re: The Truth about Stimulants, posted by bleauberry on December 11, 2011, at 15:04:41
I would have to agree with Bleuberry in that stimulants are very tricky to get right and a lot of it is just experimentation. For example, if I take Adderall or Vyvanse without my MAOI (Parnate), I get a big rush of positive emotion but it's then followed by a very deep depression which becomes only worse when I try taking more Adderall/Vyvanse. Everybody seems to react differently so the key is to find what works best for you.
By the way, what kind of herb are you referring to Bleuberry?
Posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 17:31:49
In reply to Re: The Truth about Stimulants, posted by Sailboat77 on December 11, 2011, at 16:09:55
What herb are you talking about BB?
I am struggling with Inattentivness. Have all throughout my life but this is the first time I have really identified it and actually believe I have been misdiagnosed all my life.
I match every symptom for add inatentive type and mentally I can trace alot of my depression and anxiety to being inatentive.
Posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 17:43:18
In reply to Re: The Truth about Stimulants, posted by bleauberry on December 11, 2011, at 15:04:41
rhodiola rosea?
I am heading to the shop tonight to get some.
Also some Magnesium supplements.
Posted by rjlockhart04-08 on December 11, 2011, at 18:23:59
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
It really depends on how much a person actually wants the stimulantion from a stimulant. Some people can take them for years and be fine, because their personality isnt addictive or having a risk of abuse which is exactly what happened to me. I abused stimulants until I had a siezure that casued me to forget everything that I was doing that day. I couldnt talk for a couple minites because I lost my speech capibility for a couple min.
Stimulants are psychostimulants that immprove brain fuction in people who hav low levels of stimulation in the brain. That's why people with ADHD figit because their trying to create some kind of stimulation. When stimulants are taken they calm down this by increasing the firing of nuerotransmitters and brain signals.
The option for a long term use depends on the person. Yes they can cause depedence, but again it just depends on the person's circumstance and how they adapt to the medication. Tolerance can build up very quickly thats why some people have to take high doses. Although 60mg of dextroamphetamine is the recommended max dose, i've heard many cases where they have used it from 90mg a day to 120mg a day. This is for dextroamphetamine. Their was a person here that took various narcotics such as Seconal, Adderall, Xanax, and he died. Again if the person is destructive in their ways of taking them, then that will lower their quality of life and increase chances of death.
I was on 60mg of dextoamphetamine for about 2 years. It was fine I just tended to want to get high on amphetamine. I would go a couple weeks without abusing it and then I would have a binge period where i would repeatdly take them over again after they wore off. I HATED the crash. Before this I was on adderall and ofcourse I abused that. The problem is I am in a sitation where I cant take as long as live at home. I have to move out and I can't even hold a stable job without having stimualnts to help me. It's very devestating. Im going to have alot of assistance with this.
If I was responsible for my action and lived up to taking them correctly I would not have to suffer this after effects of life after stimulants.
Yet, foreveryone else they can be a very effective treatment in treating depression, fatigue, adhd, and narcolepsy. It just depends on the persona and how they react to it.
Matt
Posted by Phidippus on December 11, 2011, at 19:13:24
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
For some, they are the only viable option long term.
Most studies show that few patients taking stimulants develop a dependence on them. With newer formulations such as Vyvanse and Concerta, delayed release eliminates dependence.
I've been on stimulants for many years and have never experienced a tolerance for them.
Eric
Posted by huxley on December 12, 2011, at 4:40:08
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
This is the sort of thing that terrifies me.
http://ehealthforum.com/health/adderall-withdrawal-symptoms-t134586.html
Posted by sk85 on December 17, 2011, at 16:18:47
In reply to Re: The Truth about Stimulants » Sailboat77, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 17:31:49
I personally wouldn't recommend stimulants for depression issues. Ritalin made my life into sort of a roller coaster and I believe in the long term made my depression worse. There have been animal studies as well showing that Ritalin can promote depression like behaviour after chronic use.
But for ADD/ADHD I'm not an expert, just for emotional and motivational issues there are much safer and better alternatives.-Ikaros
Posted by torrid2 on December 22, 2011, at 15:32:28
In reply to The Truth about Stimulants, posted by huxley on December 11, 2011, at 2:45:19
I'm on stimulants for about 15 years and tolerance hasn't been an issue on low or high doses. rebound is hard on higher doses. I had to move to another state and my new doc of the past 4 years cut my dose in half. Tolerance hasn't been a problem at all with concerta, funny thing is I get AD poopout so easy but I have no problem with concerta.
This is the end of the thread.
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