Posted by yxibow on August 24, 2008, at 3:42:31
In reply to Re: antihistamines/neuroleptics 2 put somebody sleep, posted by sdb on August 24, 2008, at 1:55:03
> > Benadryl (diphenhydramine, others) is I think usually dosed out at 25-100mgs/nightly for sleep.
(Benadryl) diphenhydramine and (Dramamine) dimenhydrinate are basically the same drug with a chemical substitute, one is less powerful in some ways. There is also doxylamine succinate which is used in -some- versions of Unisom. Its cheaper to take the benadryl for allergies than for sleep by marketing sakes. But at any rate yes, up to about 75mg a night is safe.
> > If you're trying to choose between an antihistamine and a neuroleptic for sleep, I'd say go for hydroxyzine. The dosage varies wildly (some people doze off at 50mgs; I used to take 200mgs), but once you hit the right dose its relatively safe stuff...if I recall correctly, higher doses can help with anxiety. It occasionally causes tardive dyskinesia, but I think the risk is a lot lower than with neuroleptics.
I'm not sure there's a lot of risk of TD with Atarax, its slightly different and proto-antihistamine and they're not particularly pleasant agents in the end, for sleep. It was used at a time when other agents weren't available for anxiety mainly.
> > In some countries Nozinan (I think that's how its spelled) is used as a sedative. Its a densely sedating neuroleptic; the sleep-aid doses are pretty low, so I imagine the TD/NMS/EPS risks would be pretty small.
> > Low-dose Seroquel is popular for sleep, but at very low doses the stuff is just an extremely expensive antihistamine. Low dose of Thorazine are still sometimes used as a sleep aid.
If chlorpromazine (Largactil) is still used as a sleep aid, well I have no words -- a 25mg dose of Seroquel is infinitely safer and has nearly no AP effects at that level.
>
> in the literature hydroxyzine belongs to the same class as cetirizine (classic med used as anti-allergic) but with more sedating and less anticholinergic properties. Actually a good profile. I don't like so much the 1. class antihistamines like diphenhydramine, doxylamine etc. because these can people cause jerks, little seizures, urinary retention...
You are correct- urinary retention and other things can be caused by classic antihistamines and related alkaloids, they have a classic connection to atropine.certrizine is a vertigo medication, at least here, although meclizine is used more often, they are related and do have atropine properties I can tell you with "Dramamine II" (meclizine) -- perhaps certrizine has less. Meclizine is not terribly sleep-inducing.
There seem to be a lot of antihistamines used for vertigo, travel sickness and other stuff that could be used better as a sleep med than the official ones like diphenhydramine. Clearly there are the benzos and atypical benzos but it's better to avoid this IMO.
>
> med_empowered: what's with the hangover effect the next morning due to its long half-life with hydroxyzine?
>
> warm regards
>
> sdb
poster:yxibow
thread:847868
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20080822/msgs/847949.html