Posted by Larry Hoover on September 2, 2004, at 9:34:10
In reply to Follow up ?? » Larry Hoover, posted by Racer on August 31, 2004, at 10:54:29
> Thank you so much for answering. I have two follow up questions, if you've got the time and energy at the same time.
>
> The first is how adrenaline fits into the picture. I know it does, and I know I've looked it up in the past, but I don't seem to have it in me right now to look it up again.Adrenaline levels can remain chronically high if your cortisol levels are high as well. If that is the case, your adrenals have not yet begun to fail. This is a serious health factor, though. Sustained exposure to high cortisol and its associated hormones, such as adrenaline, is very hard on the body.
If you have days where you just crash and can't get up, you are entering into the realm where your adrenals have begun to fail, but they still work pretty well, most of the time.
The solution is the same, in all cases of adrenal stress. Nutrients to support the adrenals, and interventions to try and get the hypothalamus to settle down. That's the simple case, but a sustained sense of hypercortisolemia can be induced by e.g. a pituitary tumour. Most of those are benign (as compared to malignant cancers), but not benign in what they do to you. I really think some bloodwork would provide some useful information.
http://www.womentowomen.com/LIBadrenalfatigue.asp
http://www.digitalnaturopath.com/cond/C17649.html
(I don't agree with absolutely every thing on this site, but it's pretty darn accurate, over all. Note the nutrient recommendations at the bottom, and herbs to consider.)> Second is about me, right now, while I'm still recovering from something I think I can safely call a breakdown over the last couple of weeks. (I'm just in the process of trying to figure out what I'm feeling. The signs I associate with a panic attack -- racing heart, shallow breaths -- I never really experience, so never thought that was a problem. Now I'm learning that I do experience periods of very high arousal, shall we say, but the signs include very tight feeling around the diaphragm and slow, regular, deep breaths. So I'm weird, like that's news?) Now that things are settling down, I'm aware of what I am starting to recognize as adrenaline surges at almost any stimulus. Typing this post is enough to get my adrenaline up, talking to anyone, trying to do anything. Basically, the only time it doesn't seem to start ramping up is if I can just lie on the sofa and stare at the TV -- but that relaxed let down allows the depression to run rampant.
That's called hypervigilance, and is a physically-learned event. Your amygdala is in a bad habit, is one simple way to look at it. The amygdala processes new emotions, and is involved in retrieving old emotional memories. There's a bad feedback loop operating in you right now, I think. The thing is to intervene with nutrients. Fish oil, magnesium, pyridoxine, vitamin C, zinc, and a B-complex are probably the most critical interventions. Niacinamide too (500 mg, up to 4 times per day), when you're most symptomatic. You might also get a real calming effect from taurine (2 grams, as needed).
> My question about that is whether that hyper-reactivity, that adrenaline prompt at even very slight stimulation, will settle down again, and how long it might take.
It's not likely to settle down without some intervention on your part. During episodes of high cortisol, your kidneys get less selective, and you lose massive amounts of key nutrients in your urine. That's acceptable, if your daily intake is sufficient to replenish them. But if not, you go into a massive functional malnutrition. Without sufficient magnesium, zinc, pantothenate, and vitamin C (especially these), your body has lost a good part of its ability to stop being so reactive. You're in a vicious cycle, and you need to break the cycle.
> I'm also wondering if that's part of your adrenal exhaustion meaning?
If you're always hypervigilant, you're not there yet. If you're sort of getting an inconsistent state of hypervigilance (hyper most of the time, but also periods of deep exhaustion and cognitive dysfunction), then you're on the edge of the cliff already.
> And if there's anything -- besides time -- that can reduce it. (Trust me, NOT a feeling conducive to recovery.)
The two links above give some good ideas to think about.
> Thank you, Larry. If you want any other information about what it feels like, I think "YUCK!" just about covers it. ;-)
I hear you. It takes months to get your adrenals fully reined in again. It took months to get this way. There is no quick fix, but you can address the symptoms (magnesium, taurine, phophstidylserine, niacinamide).
Keep talking. Keep asking questions. You'll take in enough to get on the route to calmer waters.
Lar
poster:Larry Hoover
thread:383709
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/health/20040729/msgs/385625.html