![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ THIS: I need someone's help badly. (Please please don't move this to the Faith section, it's not about Faith, I think it's OCD and Depression.)
Hello everyone, I new to boards and I am suffering greatly from my fear of death.
In fact, to say I suffer greatly is an understatement. I am obsessed with it. I am constantly having panic attacks and my entire body has been trembling constantly in fear for the last week. My arms and chest feel under pressure and I sometimes feel as though I am losing my connection with reality.
My problem is this: I am absolutely terrified to die. I know that one day I must, and although I am young now and in good health, I know this won't always be the case.
When I was a child, I attended a private Catholic school and was taught that Christianity was the truth from an early age.
In August of 2002, I had a breakdown after a bad experience with a girl I liked (I was still a Christian at this time). I thought many times about killing myself, and began to think more and more about death and dying and the afterlife.
After studying religion greatly, reading many books, and spending my nights crying, I decided in April of 2003 that I did not believe in God anymore. This was shock for me, because I was VERY devout Christian before. I prayed every night and bowed my head whenever I drove by a church or saw a cross.
But starting in April of 2003, I officially did not believe in God.
However, the first few weeks of my atheism were a nightmare, very much like I experienced in August of 2002 and what I'm experiencing right now (which started about a week ago). I kept, "what if I'm making the wrong decision?" "what if I burn in hell for all eternity?"
These questions really terrified me because I'm quite intelligent and I have a nice ability to grasp large and far reaching concepts, so words like "eternity" and my curious imagination only made my fear of death worse.
After those few scary weeks in April of 2003, I was fine. I did not believe in God and I was happy with it. I did well for the next 3 years, with only a few very very short (maybe a few hours at a time) "I'm going to hell" panic sessions.
MY PROBLEM IS THIS: Christianity makes no sense to me. I could not believe in it if I tried. I really could not. I will not go into detail of my disagreements with Christianity, because I don't want to fill this forum of OT religious discussion. But my general beef is, how could God punish people for all eternity for not believing in something that makes no sense? Including myself!!
I CANNOT believe, no matter what, if I said believed, I'd be lying, because deep down I know that religion is unjust.
*****And I'm terrified I'm wrong, although deep down, I know I am not. It's just my intellectual humility leaving that gap open that I could be wrong.******
What if I burn in hell? What if my friends (the non-Christian ones) do? They don't deserve that, they're good people just trying to live their lives, not their fault they don't believe a bunch of contradictive old stories.
Currently my religious belief is that I cannot "believe in God," but only "hope" that a truly loving God exists (one that doesn't torture people for all eternity), it's impossible to do anything more.
Has anyone ever dealt with this?
Should I see a priest? (I'm thinking about it)
Should I see a psychiatrist? (I'm thinking I should)
Should I just get on medications until I drugged to the point where I don't care? (I hope it doesn't come to this, I might go to hell for not caring).
SUMMARY: Someone help me, I'm too intelligent to accept Christianity, but I was brainwashed as a child to believe it and I cannot stop the fear of going to hell. It's not my fault I don't believe! I'm just trying to search for something that makes sense.
WHAT DO I DO? This fear has taken so much from me. I failed out of college from it. I can't advance my career because I spend too much time worrying about this. I don't have the self-esteem to meet a girl. And my body is shaking and I'm crying as I write this. This is eating away my entire life. I am currently 22 years old and have been dealing with it for nearly 4 years.
What do I do?
(Please note, I'm not in danger of suicide at this moment, but I am still am stricken with fear beyond words. To the point where I feel disconnected with reality.)
Please don't turn this into a discussion about religion, I don't want to flood the board with a big religious debate. I would classify this post as "Fear of Death and the Unknown."
Would a psychiatrist be able to help me? If so, in what ways?
Posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:13:25
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
This might belong in the social thread, I'm very sorry if it's the wrong place. I'm new, I didn't mean to go OT.
I just was worried someone would move it to the "Faith" thread and I would only get a bunch of "don't worry, Jesus loves you!!" replies.
I have a real problem and I need real answers.
Thank you and sorry for the mishap.
Posted by serena11 on May 18, 2006, at 5:41:41
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
I think you should look for professional help. If I may be so bold, you remind me of a ship that has hit the shoals some time ago and is still trying to sail with water pouring in, a lost compass, and a pretty angry and bewildered sailor. So drop anchor the best you can and talk about some of the losses you've experienced, like the former girlfriend. Talk about why that was so devastating. You sound like a real thinker, but your thoughts are getting tangled up. Perhaps your feelings also need an outlet. Maybe a short period of medication will help ease the current crisis (I wouldn't recommend Zoloft, since that drug seems to cling to the brain like Velcro....) Let someone be your lighthouse for a while. Does it sound appealing to lean on someone else for a while? I am sure you will find your way. And God can take care of his own reputation.
Posted by fallsfall on May 18, 2006, at 7:46:37
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
I think that talking to a therapist could help. It does sound like an obsession to me. Can you ask your regular doctor for a referral? Cognitive Behavioral Therapy works pretty well with obsessions.
I hope you can find some peace.
Posted by madeline on May 18, 2006, at 7:55:25
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
Michael,
Hello! And welcome to babble. You've come to a good place.
I can empathize with everything you said and I can feel the hurt in your post.
Michael it's going to be okay, it's really going to be okay. Why? Because you are okay. Whatever is happening with you, you are handling it the best way you know how. Here on earth, among the living that's more than enough.
It is so easy sometimes to get sort of "locked" into black and white thinking. Something is either all good or it just is all bad.
Usually things are not that simple, and it's that gray area that can we can't stand - gives us all kinds of problems. For me, Christianity is one of those gray areas.
But, when you throw in religion to the mix and put your mortal soul on the line, things can hit a fevered pitch.
But, have you considered that this may not be about religion at all? But about something that else that was forced on you during your childhood that you are desparately trying to reject?
I think before you go to a priest, you need to go to a psychiatrist. You need to develop some coping skills to help you handle how you feel a little better. Therapy can help that. It really can. Are there resources available to you that can help you get there?
Please don't be so quick to discount drugs. Not all of them will put you in a stupor. As an adjunct to therapy, medication can really help you to process things better and allow you to think more clearly.
Again, welcome to babble. Please keep us posted on your progress.
Maddie
Posted by Larry Hoover on May 18, 2006, at 8:08:09
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
> In fact, to say I suffer greatly is an understatement.... This fear has taken so much from me.... This is eating away my entire life.... I am still am stricken with fear beyond words.... To the point where I feel disconnected with reality.
All that energy, all your body's energy, is pouring out in such magnitude that I almost struggle to empathize. As an first post, this one stands out. Welcome, Michael. I think you've come to the right place. That's a pretty fine accomplishment, right there.
> Would a psychiatrist be able to help me? If so, in what ways?Yes. First off, medication to calm you would really be the most important act. The intent is not to turn you into a zombie. No, the intent is just to turn down the volume control. The primary issue is not the content of your obsessions, but the magnitude. A psychiatrist is the best source of the medication that would be useful.
Second, a psychiatrist can assure you, with the backing of his knowledge and training and experience, that you will be able to manage living your life again. Without doubt, you will manage this.
Third, a psychiatrist can often assist you in determining if complementary therapies might be useful. I strongly suspect that you would benefit from cognitive therapy.
But, first things first. You need the medication that will bring you some relief from this intense place you find yourself. You might even consider attending at an emergency room, as at least then, you won't have to wait long for treatment. There is no valid reason to delay obtaining some relief.
Michael, welcome to Babble. Please let us know how you make out, over the coming days.
Lar
Posted by fairywings on May 18, 2006, at 9:46:10
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
Hi Michael,
Welcome to babble. I agree with everyone else, seeing a psychiatrist, and soon...so you can get some relief.
I also agree about going to therapy - a therapist can help you work on your crisis of faith....they won't judge, and if they're good they won't express a bias. I had the same thing happen when both of my parents died w/in 8 months of each other, and I had post partum depression at the same time. A good therapist is worth their weight in gold.
Aside from therapy, if you decide to see a someone about faith, maybe you could find someone who wouldn't present a bias, someone well versed in all the various faiths and cultures - to see faith from a complete historical basis? Someone who can help you with your crisis, and not try to make you feel pressured one way or another.
I hope you can get to a good psychiatrist very soon, and if you feel yourself losing touch before you can get in, maybe go to the emergency room to get some meds to get you through....or go see your general practitioner to give you something to get you through.
fw
Posted by B2chica on May 18, 2006, at 12:37:40
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
M
you do seem VERY worked up about this. are you currently on any medication? i'm thinking some benzo's might do you some good. i think the obsessive thinking is not so much ocd as it is anxiety which propetuates itself.i don't think you should get 'doped up' to where you 'don't care'. but so you can at least explore your questions of your faith without having physical reactions. no more panic attacks.
you have legitimate questions about your faith that most intelligent people at one point in their life or another reach. i believe that if your religion is a good one then it will endure your questions and still be there for you in the end.
as for if you should see a priest. well, that is for you to decide. but if you do, prepare yourself, go to him with questions, not arguements, ask for explanations not lectures. if it is a good priest he will certainly do what he can for you.
for that matter, what about going to see other clergy/holymen as well?
but i digress, i don't mean for this to become a religious discussion.as for seeing a psychiatrist. yes, i think you should see one. you could also see your general physician if you feel comfortable with him/her, otherwise do go see a psychiatrist and see if they can Rx anything for you and your anxiety.
best wishes and...WELCOME.
b2c
Posted by orchid on May 18, 2006, at 13:33:08
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
Hi,
I agree with what everyone else said - See a psychiatrist and do therapy. It would help.But also, since you have been a Christian and now lack that faith, I think you also need some sort of religious clarity. I don't think therapy alone would help you, you need something in addition to it, IMHO. I know the intense struggles that comes with questions about faith and after life etc. I have been in many rocky places regarding questions about faith and it is very difficult to overcome them.
I don't know much about Christianity and what it says, but in my religious belief (Hinduism), there is no concept of eternal torture or burning in hell forever. You pay for your sins by taking birth again and suffering. But then if you atone for your sins in that birth you can get a decent birth in the next life. Also, even within one birth time, you can pray to God to forgive your sins truly, and you can be eliminated of some of the sins (Karma). So you keep going on taking repeated birth and death cycles, and eventually when you become pure enough, you go back to Godhead and enjoy there. There is no concept of eternal pain and suffering - it is only a concept of the soul taking birth repeatedly and that also God can guide the soul if the soul decides to take the guidance.
I am not going to preach about Hinduism and am neither asking you to consider it, but I offered the point of view, only as a proof that alternate forms of faith exists where there is no eternal pain. Even within Christianity, you might find some sects or groups who perhaps don't believe in eternal pain, and you might be better off with them. Just a thought.
Take Care
Orchid.
Posted by Poet on May 18, 2006, at 13:42:33
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
Hi Michael,
It sounds like you are really obsessed with this and I think meds might help your brain slow down the thought train. No matter what the subject matter is, obsessive thoughts and phobias are intrusive. When they interfer with your everyday life it's time to get some help. I know when my mind starts going, it's enough to make me dizzy.
I agree with other posters that therapy might be a good idea in addition to meds. They go hand in hand for me.
Please post what you decide to do.
Welcome to babble. I've found it to be a great source for advice, I hope you do, too.
Poet
Posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 20:28:05
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
Hello everyone, I read everyones replies and I
really thank you for your comments. I really
helps just to vent this situation.Today I felt much better than yesterday (when I
was in panic mode nearly all day), but I was still
quite jittery and I rarely took my mind off the
subject of death and religion thoughout the entire
day, going through my usual routine of debating
myself and rollercoaster ups and downs.My fears usually get worst at night, and as of
right now (8 pm), they're starting to increae, but
not nearly as much as before. I think it will be
managable tonight. I just need to get my mind
focused on something else.serena11: I think you ship annology is very
accurate. I am forcing something onto myself I do
not want, but the only reason the fear won't go
away is because of that "unknown" factor. I
defeat my logic by thinking "Is God testing me?"
"Maybe the key to heaven is to give up your own
logic and intelligence and trust God?"But those are self defeating arguments. If God
wanted us to be stupid, we would fall victim to
any one of tens of thousands of crazy religions
out there, that statisticially for the entire
world, that's unjust.I am goign to considering seeing a professional
about this, but I will take it slow with that. I
don't want to get there, and be lying down telling
the therapist my problems and all of sudden in the
first session say "oh I feel better now, thank for
the help, time to go home!" I don't want to waste
their time if this isn't going to be a lasting
problem, although so far I know it has been.madeline: Thanks for the advice. I however
wasn't trying to discount drugs. I actually wish
I could be "drugged" to be like everyone else
sometimes. I certainly consider myself very
different from most people (although you wouldn't
know it from the outside).I just want be like everyone else, live like
everyone else, not worrying so much, living life,
being social, and constantly searching for
enjoyment.Larry Hoover: I agree the volume needs to be
turned down. The problem is two things. THe
"unknown" factor. Something nobody living will
ever find out, which is what happens when you die.
And the second one is the word "eternity" which
terrifying. It's hard to turn down the volume on
that word when you have someone like me who is
constantly trying to grasp the entirety of that
word. My mind is very curious about concepts it
may come across, and sometimes it just gets out of
hand where my mind just becomes unreasonable in
it's assumptions just of the sake of discovery.And it's taking an enourmous about of engery.
It's all I think about. Not like my life depended
on it, but like my ETERNITY depended on it (which
to my mind, it thinks it does).fairywings: Thanks it's good to know others have
experienced this and overcome it. My worst one
was the one back in August of 2002 and it's was
far worst than the one I'm having now (because it
was the first attack), and after about 6 months, I
was about to be normal for the next 3 years with
only a few minor bad thoughts every there and then
(usually only at night).B2chica: I'm not currently on medication or
receiving treatment of any sort. In fact, this
message board is the first time I've ever told
anyone about this. I've gone to great lengths to
hide it from everyone when it got bad.I really do wish I didn't care like most people,
even if it meant getting "dopped up." Most people
don't really thinkg about this stuff. They just
accept it or reject. Not much thought involved
for most people. I wish I was like that.As far as my religion being good, it's already
been proved by myself to be untrue. The just
those few "what if I'm wrong?" or "what if this is
a test from God?" type fears. That's the hardest
part. I think about it night and day and debate
it over and over and read voraciously and I see no
reason why these things should be true. It's
illogical, lacks evidence, and is personally
insulting, but it's the "threat of eternity" that
still scares me. "Eternity" I really don't like
dealing with that word.orchid: I'm glad you understand. But I wish I
was born a Hindu, atleast you don't have to deal
with the word "eternity." That's a scary word.
And to add insult to injury, the eternal
punishment is not because you were bad person, but
ONLY because you did not accept a very illogical
belief system, of which no matter what you did,
you would never be able to believe. Almost like
you were born only to burn in hell and you had no
choice in the matter. That's a terrifying
thought.Poet: You reminded me, this is very similar to
when I was a little kid. When I was little I was
absolutely terrified of space aliens and ghosts.
I know most kids are, but the possible reality of
those really terrified me. I wasn't scared of the
"Boogie man," but after watching one too many UFO
documentaries, it really convinced me they could
be real and out to get me. But I managed defeat
those fears for the most part. Although I still
to this day glance around my room when I wake up
in the middle of night to make sure nothing
unEarthly is there to probe me with some sort of
alien medical instrument (but my logic kicks in
and I brush it off after a few seconds and go back
to sleep).THANK YOU VERY MUCH EVERYONE FOR YOUR REPLIES.
Posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 20:37:06
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
I'm sitting here as usual every night listening to
my favorite music, which has always been
"Morrissey," and the song I happened to be
listening ("Yes, I am Blind" by Morrissey) to is very reflective
of what I am experiening. Espcially the last part:"Little lamb..
On a hill..
Run fast if you can..
Good Christians, they want to kill you,
And your life has not even begun !
You're just like me, you're just like me
Oh, your life has not even begun !"I am young and I feel like my life is just
starting, but certain thoughts are attempting to
end my life before it's even begun.Music really helps and if anyone anyone else
hasn't noticed yet, I encourage them to use their
favorite music to help them cope/express their
problems. I really helps a lot.
Posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 22:56:01
In reply to Intense Fear of Death - Some please help me., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 1:01:37
I thought about it and I didn't mean to offend
anyone who has different beliefs than me. I was
just trying to find some footing. It seems I get
picked on by these fears when my self esteem is at
it's lowest. I'm very sorry about that.Well goodnite everyone and I hope you can get through
your problems as well and find happiness.Good luck.
Posted by serena11 on May 20, 2006, at 12:25:04
In reply to Re: Intense Fear of Death - sorry and goodnite., posted by Michael83 on May 18, 2006, at 22:56:01
I can't speak for anyone else, but I could hardly be offended by someone pouring out their fear and desires. I appreciate your honesty and am glad you have found a voice for all your inner turmoil. I trust that ultimately, your voice will sing for joy.
Posted by cecilia on May 26, 2006, at 3:54:43
In reply to Re: Intense Fear of Death - sorry and goodnite., posted by serena11 on May 20, 2006, at 12:25:04
I too have an intense fear of death. And the trouble is, while we worry about a lot of things that never happen, death is the one thing that's 100% guaranteed. Cecilia
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.