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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by James K on January 10, 2006, at 14:26:39
The revelation that author James Frey in his book A Million Little Pieces, may have exaggerated his past got me to thinking about my own.
I always carry some denial about alcohol and substance abuse problems. Sitting here right now, I feel pretty good 26 days sober (that's one of my top ten periods most likely) and that life isn't bad. Maybe things aren't a big deal.
But, - every once in a while in a therapy, I'm forced to do a timeline or list things that have happened. In that light, it becomes almost unbelievable. We've all been here and there and done this and that.
I'm just rambling aloud about, I guess about how I can still consider starting again, and feeling amazement that I've made it this far alive and intact.
THEY tell us to take it "day by day", but it seems day by day is all I've ever lived. Only when I can see my life as a continuous line, and not as random blocks of experience, does any of this start to make sense.
still wondering,
James K
Posted by vbAgent on January 10, 2006, at 19:27:47
In reply to our histories, posted by James K on January 10, 2006, at 14:26:39
Hi James K,
I've been thinking about my past substance use and medical history, among other things. Like you, my life experiences seem like a fragmented series of unrelated events. Sometimes I see the big picture - and THEN I understand; I see clearly. I've never had a verifiable substance abuse problem. In high school I tried LSD once and marijuana only a few times; just your common and harmless experimentation that many people get into as a teenager. I went to college. Transferred twice. Made the Dean's List a couple of times. Overall, academically I did fairly well. I decided on computer science as a major but didn't finish. I stopped mid-way into my junior year. A few years earlier was when I started having psychological problems. So, like any unhappy person I saw a psychiatrist.
I tried a variety of psychotropic medications. Most of them screwed me up. Antidepressants. Anti-anxiety. Antipsychotics. The only medications that I did NOT have an unfavorable, adverse reaction to were the stimulants. Unfortunately, the stimulants arrived a little too late. The other drugs interfered...and I was a mess. The light at the end of the tunnel was that of an oncoming train. FYI, I was diagnosed with ADHD in kindergarten and again in college. The diagnosis was also confirmed later by a military psychiatrist while at basic training. I have a family history of ADHD, mood disorders and substance abuse. I eventually stopped taking all of the medications and joined the military, only to be discharged soon after due to high blood pressure, severe ADHD symptoms and something called Anxiety
Disorder NOS (not otherwise specified). I am now 28 years old.Currently, I take Adderall 15-30mg/day and Lunesta 2mg for adult ADHD and insomnia, respectively. Also, I take medications for high blood pressure and allergies. It doesn't seem right to be taking so many drugs at my age. Anyway, occasionally I use marijuana to relax and help fall asleep. I rarely drink alcohol. I have never used hard core drugs nor do I have a desire to use them. I simply want peace of mind. I want to be allowed to improve my quality of life without fear of arrest; without shame; without excessive self-reproach. All things considered, I feel like a substance abuser. I may have an addictive personality. Should I feel guilty? Am I just being too hard on myself? Well, these are just some thoughts. I didn't plan on typing this much. It would be wise to share this with my therapist. We haven't gotten too personal yet.
Peace... ;-]
Posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 13:21:37
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt » James K, posted by vbAgent on January 10, 2006, at 19:27:47
FYI, cannabis use and insomnia didn't happen at the same time. Insomnia trouble began in the middle of '04 and cannabis use started around this past Nov '05. But I wonder, could my recent bout of insomnia be somewhat attributed to withdrawal due to abstinence from cannabis? It's hard to tell. The last time I smoked was about two weeks ago. I tend to use it on an intermittent basis. So, any thoughts on whether withdrawal from intermittent use can cause severe insomnia or aggravate it? If you're like me it helps you to fall asleep! Anyway, your feedback and experiences are greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Posted by vainamoinen on January 12, 2006, at 14:55:14
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt » James K, posted by vbAgent on January 10, 2006, at 19:27:47
My experience with addiction is the following.
1) Compulsion, I feel compelled to use the substance whether or not it is fun or pleasurable. Sometimes I can control my using. Sometimes I cannot.
2) Obsession, I think about using my drug of choice when I am not under the influence.
3) Solutions, I think that a drug or drugs are the solution to my problems when in reality they are causing them or at least contributing to them.
Most people will tell you that addiction is when the use of a substance produces negative life consequences such as health, legal, employment, or relationship problems.My opinion is that it is possible to be addicted and "maintain" some semblance of a normal life.
Especially if the drugs are legal prescription drugs or are less toxic than alcohol. So the outward consequences may not be the best way to diagnose addiction.Here's a pretty easy way to tell if you have a problem.
Try to stop using for a while. Maybe just a week or a few days. If you find yourself thinking about your drug of choice a lot or can't stop for a few days than I'd say it's a problem.
After all if using isn't a problem, stopping shouldn't be a problem.
Also, the alcohol/drugs may be masking a more serious psychiatric condition.
Good Luck!
Posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 15:33:39
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt, posted by vainamoinen on January 12, 2006, at 14:55:14
Yeah, I don't quite fit the description of a substance abuse disorder. I do think that a prescription medication is aggravating something...and I think this medication is the stimulant, Adderall. Adderall could very well be making me an agitated, irritable insomniac. Yes, it can even do this if I follow the prescribing directions, avoid taking it late in the day and take a low dose. My sensitivity to stimulant medications is my mind & body's way of telling me something. I shouldn't ignore it. I have already decided to stop taking Adderall and Lunesta for a while.
Thanks for your post. ;-]
Posted by James K on January 12, 2006, at 16:28:02
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt, posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 15:33:39
> Yeah, I don't quite fit the description of a substance abuse disorder.
--I don't really think your history is one of a typical substance abuser either. But, you do seem to have worries about it and that can lead to guilt and self recrimination (is that word used right?). I guess I'm saying if it bothers you it's a problem.
--Only once in my life was pot my main drug of choice, and that was a few years ago. It didn't do me any good with my thought patterns. When I quit, I did have some problems for a while. I believe it was clearing my system.
* I do think that a prescription medication is aggravating something...and I think this medication is the stimulant, Adderall.
---I would also take a look at whatever you are taking for allergies. Antihistamines hit me weird, and I wouldn't want to combine them with a stimulant.
---good luck, and take some vitamins if you aren't.
James K
Posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 16:53:29
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt, posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 15:33:39
Denial is a sign that you may have a problem. The stimulant is the problem. I have justified the (responsible and cautious) use of stimulants because I have received a diagnosis of ADHD a number of times throughout my life. I am treating a verifiable mental disorder, right? It's documented. So, the use was justified. The use was legal. The use served a purpose by treating ADHD. Interestingly, I experience insomnia with and without being under the influence of stimulants; I've taken breaks from stimulants for weeks at a time. To reitereate, it's important to bear in mind that I don't misuse or abuse Adderall because I'm hypersensitive. It's aggravating something. Anyway, recent use of cannabis is probably to ameliorate the negative effects of a stimulant. Maybe it's too soon to know for sure. Cannabis is relaxing and helps me sleep. Lunesta calms a restless mind. Adderall can cause anxiety, restlessness and insomnia. It seems almost too complicated to figure out...but I think I get it. At least (or so I think) I am narrowing the problem down. I should feel lucky that I haven't abused or misused Adderall or took a high dosage schedule. Otherwise, abruptly stopping may cause serious rebound problems. But what's next? What if the insomnia is still present, even if to a lesser degree? What if I'm still anxious or depressed? Something certainly brought me to the psychiatrist in the first place many years ago. Something is responsible for the insomnia, ADHD and Anxiety Disorder NOS diagnoses. Something was certainly responsible for being discharged from the military; I had no access to controlled medication or cannabis at basic training and I had severe insomnia. Intermittent cannabis use is only recent. So what resembles ADHD that has an anxiety and insomnia component? GAD? Bipolar? Depression? Simple anxiety? A combination thereof? I guess time will tell. The important thing is to stay away from Adderall and Lunesta for a while. I don't know at this point how long it will be before another diagnosis, if any, will be considered.
Posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 16:58:03
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt, posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 16:53:29
Wow, this is a lot of heavy stuff and I'm getting myself worked up. I tend to rush in with things...I'm impulsive that way.
As soon as I get some sleep I'll feel better.
Posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 17:01:52
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt, posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 16:58:03
Posted by James K on January 12, 2006, at 17:17:44
In reply to Damn vicious cycle...lol...Goodnight ya'll. (nm), posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 17:01:52
I don't want to get you caught up in an endless thread when you're clearly trying to figure things out, so don't feel obligated to respond to this right away or at all.
If I read you right, you're going to give up the psych meds and just take your physical meds and maybe some cannabis for a while. I don't have any problem with cannibas except for myself, so that's sounds fine.
So my only advice is to be healthy -exercise, proper supplementation, good sleep hygiene. Pay attention to some of the other posters who are going that route and see if they have anything to offer.
Moniter yourself (without obsessing) so if you ever need help, you can describe what's happening correctly. -- I think maybe I should print this and post it on my mirror.
talk to you later,
james k
Posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 17:20:02
In reply to Re: our histories - Contemplation and Guilt » vbAgent, posted by James K on January 12, 2006, at 16:28:02
> > Yeah, I don't quite fit the description of a substance abuse disorder.
>
> --I don't really think your history is one of a typical substance abuser either. But, you do seem to have worries about it and that can lead to guilt and self recrimination (is that word used right?). I guess I'm saying if it bothers you it's a problem.
>
> --Only once in my life was pot my main drug of choice, and that was a few years ago. It didn't do me any good with my thought patterns. When I quit, I did have some problems for a while. I believe it was clearing my system.
>
> * I do think that a prescription medication is aggravating something...and I think this medication is the stimulant, Adderall.
>
> ---I would also take a look at whatever you are taking for allergies. Antihistamines hit me weird, and I wouldn't want to combine them with a stimulant.
>
> ---good luck, and take some vitamins if you aren't.
>
> James KJames K, I am really obsessively worrying here. About my allergies, I avoid decongestants. I take plain 'ol Zyrtec. I also take some antihypertensive drugs - Toprol XL, Prinzide and Minixodil...The last one is heavy duty. My brain is tired from running in circles. I'm going to sleep. I've been up for a very long time.
Posted by antigua on January 13, 2006, at 8:21:25
In reply to Re: our histories - LAST RESPONSE » James K, posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 17:20:02
I just learned from my doctor that one shouldn't stop Toprol cold turkey. I didn't know that before (maybe you do), but I did it stop it because I ran out and now I can't remember if it had an effect.
best,
antigua
Posted by AuntieMel on January 13, 2006, at 8:32:57
In reply to Re: our histories - LAST RESPONSE » James K, posted by vbAgent on January 12, 2006, at 17:20:02
About insomnia - I've had it all my life, meds or no meds. I think some people are just built that way.
About stimulants - I take extended release Adderall. I think it causes less up-and-down problems than immediate release. It hasn't affected my (already bad) insomnia one way or the other.
And about the rest? You are taking several things together. There could well be an interaction between them, and over the counter drugs. Maybe it would be a good idea to consult with a pharmacist about what all you're taking together - both prescription and non-prescription.
Posted by vbAgent on January 13, 2006, at 10:24:08
In reply to Re: our histories - LAST RESPONSE, posted by antigua on January 13, 2006, at 8:21:25
> I just learned from my doctor that one shouldn't stop Toprol cold turkey. I didn't know that before (maybe you do), but I did it stop it because I ran out and now I can't remember if it had an effect.
> best,
> antiguaOh no, I'm not stopping any of the antihypertensives.
Posted by vbAgent on January 13, 2006, at 10:38:18
In reply to Re: our histories - LAST RESPONSE, posted by AuntieMel on January 13, 2006, at 8:32:57
> About insomnia - I've had it all my life, meds or no meds. I think some people are just built that way.
>
> About stimulants - I take extended release Adderall. I think it causes less up-and-down problems than immediate release. It hasn't affected my (already bad) insomnia one way or the other.
>
> And about the rest? You are taking several things together. There could well be an interaction between them, and over the counter drugs. Maybe it would be a good idea to consult with a pharmacist about what all you're taking together - both prescription and non-prescription.Maybe Adderall XR 15mg will give me less ups and downs...Or, perhaps switch to another stimulant with less cardiovascular stimulation like Focalin or Dexedrine. I don't know. I'm glad, however, that it hasn't affected your insomnia. It's frustrating to NOT know what, if anything, is causing or worsening insomnia. I don't take any herbs or over-the-counter drugs. I avoid psuedoephedrine which is a decongestant. Consulting with a pharmacist sounds like good advice. I'll consult a pharmacist at Walgreens since that's where I get everything filled.
I need to be very careful here. Clearly, I have a tendency to needlessly worry & run in circles. The running in circles part is probably the result of too much sleep deprivation. Thanks & take care. Peace...
Posted by vbAgent on January 13, 2006, at 15:38:01
In reply to Re: our histories - LAST RESPONSE » AuntieMel, posted by vbAgent on January 13, 2006, at 10:38:18
Losing sleep really makes all your problems worse. I couldn't think clearly. I lost the ability to use common sense; I lost perspective. In retrospect, both abstaining from cannabis use AND starting to drink coffee again two weeks ago may be the culprits. Caffeine potentiates Adderall in a bad way...and drinking it late in the day makes it less likely that I'll fall asleep at a decent time. So, I will limit myself to one cup of coffee in the early morning, taking none in the afternoon and night. Also, I will limit cannabis use to just two weekends out of the month. I am on probation (not for DUI or possession but) for a single count of prescription fraud. I wrote myself a script for 12 tablets of MS Contin 60mg to help me sleep in Oct '04.
The MS Contin didn't help either...I took one tablet and started itching something fierce. Afterwards, I dumped the remaining 11 tablets in the toilet. The following morning a Special Investigation's detective gave me a visit. This was when I wasn't seeing a pdoc or therapist and the insomnia was horrid. Anyway, being on probation presents the possibility of a random drug screen happening once a month.
I will continue taking 5mg of Adderall 2-3x/day along with Lunesta 2mg at night. I think abruptly stopping them is unwise; I'm taking them for a reason. The medications are helpful, but Adderall is really only helpful if I get enough sleep the night before.
Ah, the truth comes out. Any thoughts? Thanks.
Posted by James K on January 13, 2006, at 16:07:38
In reply to Re: Some insight now that I've slept..., posted by vbAgent on January 13, 2006, at 15:38:01
probably not useful thoughts.
If you could have produced the other 11 tablets, they might have thought you were less of a junkie.
please don't get yourself into more legal trouble!
I've had almost no sleep because of my upstairs neighbors coming home from their honeymoon (not because of "that"), I just got used to them being gone.
My next door neighbor put up 5 different large wind chimes and a cold front came through last night. I'm going to rearrange my bed to the back room. I'll recheck the bed fung shoe thread on social.
sticking with some meds is probably good.
The substance abuse guy at the outpatient program I go to got fired, and now I have to listen to non-alcoholic's family problems all day. (no offense to anyone, I have family problems too)
I'm recovery burned out. I may go post something silly on social.
see ya,
James k
Posted by vbAgent on January 13, 2006, at 17:33:12
In reply to Re: Some insight now that I've slept... » vbAgent, posted by James K on January 13, 2006, at 16:07:38
> If you could have produced the other 11 tablets, they might have thought you were less of a junkie.
You're probably right. I never produced anything though. They only had the fraudulent script from the pharmacy.
> please don't get yourself into more legal trouble!
I won't. It's like those radio ads dissuading people from drinking-and-driving. It's not worth it.
> I've had almost no sleep because of my upstairs neighbors coming home from their honeymoon (not because of "that"), I just got used to them being gone.
>
> My next door neighbor put up 5 different large wind chimes and a cold front came through last night. I'm going to rearrange my bed to the back room. I'll recheck the bed fung shoe thread on social.Sorry to see you're having trouble sleeping. You'll readjust. Good luck finding something useful on the Social board. Do you use ear plugs or "white noise" makers, like a small fan placed near your bed?
> The substance abuse guy at the outpatient program I go to got fired, and now I have to listen to non-alcoholic's family problems all day. (no offense to anyone, I have family problems too)Oh man, that sucks. When will you go back to your regular program? - When they find a replacement? Hope it all works out.
> I'm recovery burned out. I may go post something silly on social.Go for it. I'm off to a billiards hall to meet some co-workers in a couple of hours. Take it easy & enjoy your weekend. Peace...
This is the end of the thread.
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