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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by ed_uk on January 28, 2005, at 0:43:24
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » ed_uk, posted by Optimist on January 25, 2005, at 13:22:06
Hello Brian,
>How's your nutrition Ed?
To be honest, it's really quite poor. I can't cook so I buy a lot of takeaways!
>Not everyone has the discipline and priorities to follow a nutritional plan but I think this eating regimand is based more on moderation which everyone can follow.
Do you need to be a good cook to follow this plan? Is it time consuming to prepare the food?
Thanks for your help,
Ed.
Posted by Optimist on January 28, 2005, at 0:43:24
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » Optimist, posted by ed_uk on January 26, 2005, at 14:29:22
> Hello Brian,
>
> >How's your nutrition Ed?
>
> To be honest, it's really quite poor. I can't cook so I buy a lot of takeaways!
>
> >Not everyone has the discipline and priorities to follow a nutritional plan but I think this eating regimand is based more on moderation which everyone can follow.
>
> Do you need to be a good cook to follow this plan? Is it time consuming to prepare the food?
>
> Thanks for your help,
> Ed.Hi Ed. No, you don't have to be a cook at all to follow it. I buy protein powder which is a life saver in terms of reducing time cooking and doing dishes.
I'll give you a few examples of some meals that I typically eat. Your tastes may vary of course, but this tends to compliment my personal food likes.
6 eggs, 1 piece of toast, banana/glass of juice
~40 grams protein, ~40 grams carbohydrates2 scoops of protein powder with 200ml of oats mixed with water, and a small block of cheese
~50 grams protein, ~50 grams carbohydrates2 slices of pizza, 2 scoops protein powder with water
~50 grams protein, ~50 grams carbohydrates3 scoops of icecream, 2 scoops of protein powder
7 oz peppered steak with hotsauce, 1 potato with butter/sour cream, and a small salad with dressing
There's many other combinations I eat but you get the picture I'm sure.
I can fill you in a little more later if you'd like. I feel like I'm getting the starting of a flu so I'm not so much in the mood to be at the computer at the moment. :)
Brian
Posted by ed_uk on January 28, 2005, at 0:43:24
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » ed_uk, posted by Optimist on January 26, 2005, at 22:32:32
Hi Brian!
>Hi Ed. No, you don't have to be a cook at all to follow it.
Phew!
>I can fill you in a little more later if you'd like.
Yes, please do :-) Have you had your cholesterol measured?
Ed.
Posted by Optimist on January 28, 2005, at 0:43:24
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » Optimist, posted by ed_uk on January 27, 2005, at 12:01:04
> Hi Brian!
>
> >Hi Ed. No, you don't have to be a cook at all to follow it.
>
> Phew!
>
> >I can fill you in a little more later if you'd like.
>
> Yes, please do :-) Have you had your cholesterol measured?
>
> Ed.Yes I have, it's fine. Any reason why you ask?
Getting further in to the diet. It's really quite easy if you read labels. It doesn't need to be exact in term of the carbohydrate:protein ratio. Fat intake isn't really a big deal. Don't shy away from it, fat is what's responsible for a lot of the satiety effects of food, as well as protein.
Carbohydrates tend to increase appetite, and is one of the reasons this diet works so well. It stabilizes your blood sugar for hours at a time and tends to decrease cravings for junkfood I find.
Posted by ed_uk on January 29, 2005, at 17:28:46
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » ed_uk, posted by Optimist on January 27, 2005, at 15:29:13
Hi Brian!
>Yes I have, it's fine. Any reason why you ask?
I just wondered whether the diet was quite high in saturated fat. It's good to know that your lipids are fine!
Regards,
Ed.
Posted by Optimist on January 30, 2005, at 11:35:35
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » Optimist, posted by ed_uk on January 29, 2005, at 17:28:46
> Hi Brian!
>
> >Yes I have, it's fine. Any reason why you ask?
>
> I just wondered whether the diet was quite high in saturated fat. It's good to know that your lipids are fine!
>
> Regards,
> Ed.No it's not too high in saturated fat. But, honestly after all the research I've seen I don't believe saturated fat to be the demonized substance it is portrayed to be in the media. I believe the real culprit is trans-fatty acids/hydrogenated fat, skewed Omega 6 to 3 ratios, and skewed carbohydrate to protein ratios. Trans fats, omega 6, and carbohydrates are generally way too high for the general population. Carbohydrates consumption should be related to the amount of exercise you do i.e. a sedentary person should eat less carbos and an intense exerciser should eat more.
I personally eat about 300g of protein, 300g of carbohydrates, and 100g of fat per day. I am very active though and have higher energy needs than a sedentary person would.
A sedentary person may only need 100-150g of protein and carbos, and 30-50g of fat to achieve an energy balance. You really have to play around with it to find the proper amounts for your individual chemistry.
I believe the saying, you are what you eat. Regarding mental health I think one is missing a lot of the equation if they aren't concerned with what they'rr putting in their mouth. There are a lot of hormonal, NT's, and other biochemical functions that are dependent on nutrition. You wouldn't run a sports car on inferior gas and oil, and by the same means you shouldn't run your body the same.
I've developed an obsession, a healthy obsession I believe regarding proper nutrition, vitamins, minerals, and exercise over the years. I think it's as important to have a healthy obsession over medications as it is nutrition/exercise to learn as much as possible to overcome any mental issues we may be dealing with. Cognitive/behaviour options I believe are also an important part of the equation. After all, we don't live in a vacuum right? :)
Brian
p.s. I admire the passion you portray on the med board. You are a wonderful asset here! Do you want to go in to psychiatry, psychopharmacology, etc... sometime in the future?
Posted by ed_uk on February 4, 2005, at 9:13:28
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » ed_uk, posted by Optimist on January 30, 2005, at 11:35:35
Hi Brian,
>I believe the real culprit is trans-fatty acids/hydrogenated fat.
Well, I guess I eat quite a lot of butter but not much margarine!
>Regarding mental health I think one is missing a lot of the equation if they aren't concerned with what they're putting in their mouth.
I agree. I really need to start healthy eating, I know I would feel better if I did. My diet is very poor at the moment. I'm finding it really difficult to motivate myself to do anything. Result: far too many takeaways.
>You are a wonderful asset here!
Thank you- you are so kind!
Do you want to go in to psychiatry, psychopharmacology, etc... sometime in the future?
I'm doing pharmacy at university at the moment. I think I might work in a psychiatric hospital in the future.
Best Regards,
Ed.
Posted by Optimist on February 4, 2005, at 10:39:04
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » Optimist, posted by ed_uk on February 4, 2005, at 9:13:28
> Well, I guess I eat quite a lot of butter but not much margarine!
Butter is a good choice as opposed to margarine, due to the fat profile.
I'm kinda putting my life on hold till I get feeling better. It's kinda hard to make plans for your life when you're not operating at 100%. I'm sure you know what I mean. It took me 9 years to finish my undergrad due to chronic dysthymia. A lot of stop and go's along the way.
I'm hoping when I start the Parnate in a couple weeks that it'll allow me to work at my potential instead of trying to keep my head above water. I was thinking about doing masters/Ph.D work before but it's a little overwhelming when it's hard to think and get motivated.
I'm working at a brain injury rehabilitation facility at the moment, but for little pay as a front line worker. I need to get myself better so I can open up my career options.
I know you've had some problems getting qualified pdocs to prescribe "outside of the box". Do you think it may be worth it, taking your treatment in to your own hands at some point? I think it can be dangerous to self medicate if one doesn't have the necessary expertise but it can also be dangerous to have incompetent pdocs running your life as well. MAOI_Chairman is a good example of someone self medicating to some benefit. His doctor wouldn't prescribe an MAOI so he took it upon himself to order Parnate off the net and seems to have made a dramatic recovery. Just something to thing about...
Have you considered taking an MAOI yourself? I decided to upon not wanting to waste anymore time and going to the big guns. I find it sad how many people on these boards are jumping from SSRI to SSRI or whatever the med du jour is this month with little success. MAOIs in some respects seem to be a head above the rest in many cases.
Hope things are going well with you.Brian
Posted by ed_uk on February 4, 2005, at 11:15:56
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » ed_uk, posted by Optimist on February 4, 2005, at 10:39:04
Hi Brian!
>It's kinda hard to make plans for your life when you're not operating at 100%. I'm sure you know what I mean.
I Certainly do!
>I'm hoping when I start the Parnate in a couple weeks that it'll allow me to work at my potential instead of trying to keep my head above water.
I really hope it helps, I'm looking forward to hearing how you do. I'd progress cautiously with the dose if I were you. Fluoxetine's active metabolite (norfluoxetine) has such a long half-life that a very small quantity of norfluoxetine may still be present when you start Parnate.
>I'm working at a brain injury rehabilitation facility at the moment, but for little pay as a front line worker.
What does your job involve? What degree did you do?
>....taking your treatment in to your own hands at some point?
Yes, I think I might. A friend has agreed to give me some selegiline, I'll probably try it soon.
>Have you considered taking an MAOI yourself?
Yes, I'd like to try Parnate. I think I might ask for it when I see my new pdoc in a few weeks (or months). My old pdoc had never heard of Parnate. MAOIs are very rarely prescribed here. Also, Nardil (phenelzine) seems to be used much more commonly than Parnate (tranylcypromine).
Here is a copy of a somewhat mindless comment made in the BNF - the UK drug bible..............
'TRANYLCYPROMINE is the most HAZARDOUS of the MAOIs because of its stimulant action. The drugs of choice are PHENELZINE or ISOCARBOXAZID which are less stimulant and therefore safer.'
I'm fatigued at the moment and my anxiety levels are low - I'd much rather try Parnate. I'm not that hopeful about selegiline to be honest.> I find it sad how many people on these boards are jumping from SSRI to SSRI or whatever the med du jour is this month with little success.
Yes! Why is it necessary for people to try EVERY SINGLE SSRI before trying a tricyclic or a different type of drug?? How illogical!
Regards,
Ed.
Posted by Optimist on February 5, 2005, at 11:19:04
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » Optimist, posted by ed_uk on February 4, 2005, at 11:15:56
> I really hope it helps, I'm looking forward to hearing how you do. I'd progress cautiously with the dose if I were you. Fluoxetine's active metabolite (norfluoxetine) has such a long half-life that a very small quantity of norfluoxetine may still be present when you start Parnate.
Well when I will have started the Parnate I will have been off Prozac for 5 and a half weeks most likely. My last week of Prozac I was taking only 10mg per day as well which will aid slightly in reducing my blood concentrations of the active metabolites.
> What does your job involve? What degree did you do?
My degree is a B.A. in Psychology. It's only a 3 year as opposed to a 4 year though, so I wanted to go in to further education I'd have to get that 4th year first.
My job involves carrying out the neuropsychologist's, physiotherapist's, occupational therapist's, etc... programs directly with the clients. It's a home like setting where the guys have bedrooms, washrooms, kitchen etc... just like anyone else would. Depending on the severity of their injuries I help them get up in the morning, get meals prepared, take them on recreational outings, etc... Basically anything and everything that has to do with their prearranged rehabilitation program. Depending on what deficits the guys have I may be more of a fly on the wall, reminding them to do this or that, or I may have to do almost everything for them if they are really incapacitated.
It's not a job that requires any education. Many of the people that work there only have a highschool education. It's more like being a fancy baby sitter I'd like to think about it as. The pay is just above minimum wage here so it's definitely not considered a career job. I have to move out of my parents place, and have university loans to pay off and I'll definitely not be able to do that until I find a much better paying job! My girlfriend makes about 3 times as much as I do, if that gives any indication of how low paying mine is. :)
> Here is a copy of a somewhat mindless comment made in the BNF - the UK drug bible..............
>
> I'm fatigued at the moment and my anxiety levels are low - I'd much rather try Parnate. I'm not that hopeful about selegiline to be honest.I was interested in selegiline as a treatment choice about a year ago, but honestly I think it is a bit overhyped by a couple choice websites over the internet. The antidepressant effect isn't considered very robust compared to Nardil or Parnate, and at lower doses even with DLPA added you don't hear of many people on it long term which has to tell you something.
Yeah Parnate seems like a better choice than Nardil in your case then. The side effects appear to be much more tolerable with Parnate as well. Many people seem to quit Nardil due to them but not Parnate that I've noticed.
I think it's worth it to get aggressive with your therapy. My greatest fear is to end up in five/ten years still on these boards searching for treatment option when I really should be out there enjoying life! Also my dad and sister are both on disability to due depression and I definitely don't want that to happen to me. I'm optimistic it won't. :)
Brian
Posted by ed_uk on February 5, 2005, at 14:26:29
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » ed_uk, posted by Optimist on February 5, 2005, at 11:19:04
Hi Brian!
>Well when I will have started the Parnate I will have been off Prozac for 5 and a half weeks most likely.
A very small amount of norfluoxetine may still be present. It can't hurt to take a very small 'test dose' of Parnate for the first few days of treatment, just to be on the safe side.
>It's not a job that requires any education.
You're education will have helped you to do a better job though. I can understand why you want to progress to something else though, especially considering the low pay.
>I was interested in selegiline as a treatment choice about a year ago, but honestly I think it is a bit overhyped by a couple choice websites over the internet. The antidepressant effect isn't considered very robust compared to Nardil or Parnate, and at lower doses even with DLPA added you don't hear of many people on it long term which has to tell you something.
I agree! I doubt it will help but it's probably still worth a try.
>My greatest fear is to end up in five/ten years still on these boards searching for treatment option when I really should be out there enjoying life!
You have a job and a girlfriend. You have a degree and are physically very healthy. You are intelligent and you're being pro-active with your treatment. You seem to be doing rather well to me!
>I'm optimistic it won't :)
Me too... and we don't call you the optimist for nothing :-)Best of luck with the Parnate,
Ed.
Posted by Optimist on February 5, 2005, at 23:28:39
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » Optimist, posted by ed_uk on February 5, 2005, at 14:26:29
Hey Ed,
> A very small amount of norfluoxetine may still be present. It can't hurt to take a very small 'test dose' of Parnate for the first few days of treatment, just to be on the safe side.
I'll be starting low anyways to get used to the side effects if there are any at the beginning. Probably 10mg the first few days then I'll slowly add after that.
> You have a job and a girlfriend. You have a degree and are physically very healthy. You are intelligent and you're being pro-active with your treatment. You seem to be doing rather well to me!
True, on paper I guess it doesn't look too bad, but my life tends to go in cycles that way. Things go well, then the bottom falls out. I've had a sneeking suspicion that I may have some mild form of bipolar, perhaps cyclothymia, but my pdoc seems to think otherwise. I've been considered by my girlfriend to be a Dr. Jeckle and Mr. Hyde, and I know I can be very moody. If I have any problems with poopout or excessive moodiness on Parnate I'll definitely ask to add some lithium. My grandmother was bipolar so it is a possibility.
> Me too... and we don't call you the optimist for nothing :-)
Awwwww... thanks Ed. :)
> Best of luck with the Parnate,
Thanks, I'll keep you informed on my progress.
Brian
Posted by ed_uk on February 6, 2005, at 9:01:17
In reply to Re: Exercise Backfire. » ed_uk, posted by Optimist on February 5, 2005, at 23:28:39
Hi Brian!
>Things go well, then the bottom falls out.
That happens to me too. People say I'm self-destructive.
>I know I can be very moody.
I'm moody too, I must admit that I have been known to have some quite major temper tantrums!!
>Thanks, I'll keep you informed on my progress.
Excellent :-)
Ed.
This is the end of the thread.
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