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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Bent on November 1, 2004, at 14:30:29
Right at this moment I feel like I never want to go back to my T again. I know in five minutes I will feel different, and then in ten minutes I will feel this way again. I can’t call and say I quit, nor do I want to. But can I call and say I need a break? Can I ask for two weeks off? Will she hold a spot for me? I feel like she is so frustrated with me. I brought up termination for the first time last week and we both agreed things were going well (that is all the things I went to therapy for, my attachment to her has only gotten worse – but I didn’t tell her that) and that over the next couple months it would be good to talk about terminating. She left it up to me. She told me it took a lot of courage to bring this up on my part and that we’d keep talking about it. This week she wasn’t as sensitive about it. It just seemed like she was almost happy that I would be leaving. Like I am a big annoyance to her. I feel like she is so so frustrated with me I just want to get away for a while. If I think she's frustrated why do I want a break? Maybe I am being irrational. My mind says run, my heart says stay. I need to go breathe. Sorry if this is confusing, i am confused right now.
Posted by Speaker on November 1, 2004, at 15:13:22
In reply to Is it my therapist...or me?, posted by Bent on November 1, 2004, at 14:30:29
Bent,
I am so sorry you are going through such a difficult time. I have the same situation come up when I think about terminating. It is truely a push pull situation. My T says when I reach this point that if I choose to stay in therapy I make great strides. However, there does come a point that I will need to terminate unless I use Dinah's thinking of "forever therapy" :)...which I am considering! I'm not sure I've helped but I want you to know I don't think many go to therapy for a length of time without this situation.
Does your T know how attached you are? I'm sure this adds a different twist to the whole thing. Well, keep up the deep breathing and keep us posted when you can.
Marie
Posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 15:21:17
In reply to Is it my therapist...or me?, posted by Bent on November 1, 2004, at 14:30:29
I hate feeling conflicted, like you describe.
It's possible that the T didn't kow you were have an issue with the attachment. Logically, it seems that she was trying to talk you out of leaving at first, but by the time you two next met, she figured out that you were concerned about the attachment issue- and she may feel that you're correct, which would explain her not "having a problem" with terminating.
I really do think that your T has your best interests at heart. You said yourself that didn't even bring up those issues to the T.
Talk about the issue at hand- attachments- then talk with her about terminating. If she knows where your head is, she'll be able to react accordingly.
I expect my T to "sense" when I'm not telling her everything- and I know it's unfair of me... telling her to solve the puzzle while I'm hiding some pieces, knowingly, under the carpet, but I haven't gotten down to "firing her". I hope that I am strong enough to even get anything out of this therapy business.
And I have the same question as you, only about a different issue. Modality. The T I have is no-nonsense, deal with the here and now, learn skills, et cetera.
Psychologists have "admitted" to my having "inner child issues", but not one has ever tried to talk to that inner child- to make her feel better.
I only ever find T's who want you to "learn skills to think differently"... yet no one has given me a lesson book to study...am I supposed to learn this stuff out of thin air??
Is it ANYONE's T or is it THEM?
Yikes, chicken and egg thing again....I feel your pain; am sharing it, too, today...
-sunny10
Posted by Joslynn on November 1, 2004, at 15:32:28
In reply to Is it my therapist...or me?, posted by Bent on November 1, 2004, at 14:30:29
For me, I always want to be the one to "leave first" do you think that's it? (And by the way, it is almost always the client who makes this decision.)
With me, if I get the slightest inkling that a T, a boyfriend or whoever may leave me, even if it's my own irrational fear and not based on reality, I get these fantasies of flouncing away first. Or cooly sailing off with some pithy exit line, wearing a great outfit, while theme music plays in the background. But that's me...
Posted by Skittles on November 1, 2004, at 15:53:32
In reply to Is it my therapist...or me?, posted by Bent on November 1, 2004, at 14:30:29
Bent,
I think it is perfectly okay for you to take a bit of a therapy break. I did it myself and I think it was a very good move for me. Now granted, I only cancelled one appointment but for me that was a huge deal. I feel a much stronger attachment to my T than I'll ever admit to her and going 2 weeks without seeing her showed me that I COULD survive without her - even if it was hard. And it WAS hard, but it got less hard as the days passed. Knowing I was still capable of making it on my own made the attachment seem much less scary to me.
So if you think you need a break, take one! As far as concern about having your spot held for you, I think the best thing to do would be to let your T know ahead of time what your plan is. Just call and say that you aren't quitting, you just need a bit of a breather, you'll need X number of weeks off, and to please hold your appointment time for you after that point. And how your T handles your request will probably speak volumes about her and what the relationship with her is really like.
Please let us know what you decide and how it goes!
Skittles
Posted by fallsfall on November 1, 2004, at 17:05:07
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » Bent, posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 15:21:17
It sounds like you have been working with therapists who do Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT). You might look into a therapist who does Psychodynamic Therapy. There is quite a difference.
Falls who used to do CBT and now does Psychodynamic...
Posted by Dinah on November 1, 2004, at 18:00:03
In reply to Is it my therapist...or me?, posted by Bent on November 1, 2004, at 14:30:29
Perhaps she was just trying to be supportive. They have the oddest ideas of what might be supportive, including being all enthusiastic.
It took mine years to figure out that being overly enthusiastic about any plan for change was the best way to scare me into clinging to the status quo. He now stays fairly noncommittal and usually remembers to acknowledge the downside as well as the upside to any change. And if the change involves termination or reduction in sessions, enthusiasm floods me with abandonment fears. I'm quite unreasonable with him over it. :)
Perhaps you could just be honest with her about your amibivilance and how her reaction made you feel, while acknowledging that she was probably trying to be supportive and encouraging of growth.
Posted by Bent on November 2, 2004, at 6:54:20
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » Bent, posted by Dinah on November 1, 2004, at 18:00:03
I cant tell you all how nice it was to come home from a 12+ hour day and see all your responses. You all have given me lots to think about. I am still rather confused about this situation but I dont feel as irrational or angry. i think i will talk to my T about her reaction and that I sometimes think a break is a good idea, even though I am not entirely sure why. And maybe all the frustration I think she has with me is just a projection as to how I feel about my life right now.
I was very interested in the post a few weeks ago about secure vs insecure attachment. One reason (there are many) that has pushed me towards brining up termination in the first place is that after several yearss of insecure attachment, I now feel securely attached. But there is another factor that bothers me. While we can kinda tell whether an attachment is secure or not, how do we differentiate whether its a healthy or unhealthy attachment? I think this is really different from secure/insecure. And I think mine, although secure, is unhealthy for me anymore. That may be my number one reason for pushing myself to terminate. I havent told my t this. I will. My attachment to her is strong, it takes up too much of my life/time. Time is passing me by while I am off in fantasyland imagining my T can be my perfect mother. I am not saying I have no life at all, but its become too much of an issue for me. It makes me sad. It makes me really sad/angry that I am going to leave therapy and its killing me inside but it seems like just another day at work to her.
I will stop now. I didnt mean to go on. I guess I needed to vent! :)
Thanks for all your replies.
Posted by sunny10 on November 2, 2004, at 10:51:19
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » sunny10, posted by fallsfall on November 1, 2004, at 17:05:07
Falls-
I know that this probably differs from T to T, but did you have to look for a new T to switch to Pyschodynamic?
-sunny10
Posted by fallsfall on November 2, 2004, at 19:36:24
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » fallsfall, posted by sunny10 on November 2, 2004, at 10:51:19
I'll start a new thread below...
Posted by crushedout on November 2, 2004, at 21:04:35
In reply to Is it my therapist...or me?, posted by Bent on November 1, 2004, at 14:30:29
Interesting thread for me, because I just told my T I was taking a two-week break from her. I can imagine what you're going through is very painful because I've struggled with feeling like taking a break (often because I feel rejected, or angry and want to hurt her, often just because I think it's best for me) and have never really been able to make the move till now. It feels good, but I know this time I'm doing it for the right reason, and my expectations are realistic. I.e., I'm not hoping she'll run after me and beg me to stay, and in fact, I've set it up so that she doesn't communicate with me unless absolutely necessary. Which is a healthy way for me to protect myself.
The consultant I'm seeing about therapy with her made an excellent point, which is that this is probably going to be painful for me whatever I end up doing (I'm trying to figure out whether to end therapy altogether). Because if I decide to leave and she lets me go easily, I'll likely feel discarded and abandoned and unloved. If she "convinces" me to stay, I'll feel manipulated once again, but also cherished and loved by her. But I may still feel stuck in my transference bind.
Anyway, I thought this might be connected in some way to the feelings you're having that she wants to get rid of you. She may just want to let you go, if that's what you think's best, but we're likely to take that as a rejection, even if it's really not.
I hope this post makes sense. Sorry if I've rambled.
Posted by Bent on November 3, 2004, at 10:57:41
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » Bent, posted by crushedout on November 2, 2004, at 21:04:35
Yes, it makes sense! I am glad you were able to ask for a break. I decided not to call and ask for a break but maybe I will talk to her about it next week. When I have asked for a break in the past it has always been because I was avoiding something or I was angry or felt rejected, kinda like you said. At the same time, I feel like I have brought up this talk of termination so now my time is limited with her. It is so conflicting.
I think I can really relate to what you said about leaving being painful and being stuck in a transference bind. I think that is where I am. It’s like I don’t want her to let me go too easily cause then I will feel like nothing, but at the same time I don’t want her begging me not to go either. I wish there was a way to see through all this confusion and make it not hurt so much.
Posted by crushedout on November 3, 2004, at 20:00:56
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » crushedout, posted by Bent on November 3, 2004, at 10:57:41
Yeah, I know how much it hurts, that's for sure.But I have a question: why do you think that because you brought up termination your time is limited with her? Clients bring up termination (and are *supposed* to -- talking about it can be an important part of therapy) all the time.
Posted by Bent on November 4, 2004, at 7:23:42
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » Bent, posted by crushedout on November 3, 2004, at 20:00:56
I guess I think that my time is limited because this is the first time we have talked about terminating and she actually thought it was a good time to start to think about it. Other times when I have brought up the topic it was usually because I was avoiding something and just wanted out of the relationship. It just seems like this time was different. She thought it was a good idea too. I know termination is unavoidable - it's going to happen eventually- but I just feel like its getting closer now and therefore my time is somewhat limited. I know I can overact about this at times too. I mean my T seemed happy I could bring it up. She told me it a took a lot of courage on my part. She told me there are many ways to terminate and it was up to me. Methods, when, how much we talk about it- was all up to me. I am very grateful she is letting me control my therapy (as a therapist should). At the same time it scares me that I have brought this up. I guess it just makes the fact that I will eventually leave her more real than it has ever been. Sometimes I am very confident about it and other times I want to cling to her leg and say please dont make me leave! :)
Ok, I probably went on way too much. Does this make any sense?
Posted by Dinah on November 4, 2004, at 8:04:47
In reply to Re: Is it my therapist...or me? » crushedout, posted by Bent on November 4, 2004, at 7:23:42
Makes perfect sense to me. I went through the same thing with my therapist re going down to once a week and needing him less. If his response was the probably correct one of being happy for me, I got very upset and clingy.
And the very fact that I brought it up was as scary to me as doing it. Well, maybe not quite, but still scary.
This is the end of the thread.
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