![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 13:14:46
It was kinda rough, I was being a PINTA in the beginning, since I thought he was going to dump me. Which he did think that maybe I would feel more comfortable talking to another T about my old T. I thought he meant with the EMDR, but he planned on still doing that with me. Well in the end, I don't feel I need to talk to anyone else to just rant about it. But I will still think about it, I just might change my mind, hmmmm...
I will tell more later, I have so me thinking to do.
Posted by Dinah on August 7, 2008, at 17:53:16
In reply to Had my session today, posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 13:14:46
I hope he was able to reassure you about some of what you were thinking about him.
Posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 18:08:25
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Lemonaide, posted by Dinah on August 7, 2008, at 17:53:16
I keep thinking that maybe it would help to talk and vent about what my old T did, not talk about him with my current T, but still do the EMDR with him to help with my hurt feelings. But I don't know, I have been venting about it a lot lately,and I am not sure if it is helping.
One part that I am upset about, but not really at my current T, but my old T. I wanted to know what my old T said about me in their phone meeting, I said I had a right to know. Well my T said he wasn't going to tell me because he feels he has a right to protect me. Then I go, so it is that bad? He said it isn't that bad, but he thinks it would hurt me. I said what I am thinking is probably 10x worse than what he did say, but I could guess probably what he would say.
So now my old T dogged on me now. I am beginning not to like him so much now. Maybe he was right about one thing, he said if I ever got to really know him, I probably wouldn't like him. I think he may be right about that.
Posted by Dinah on August 7, 2008, at 18:23:05
In reply to Re: Had my session today, posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 18:08:25
I can't say that I'd like my therapist refusing to tell me what was said about me. You're right, it leads to imagining worse things than could have ever possibly have been said.
I may not like it, but I can see my therapist doing it. He might not be so blunt about it, but he probably would not tell me much. I could probably yell about it all I wanted, and he'd be sympathetic at my frustration, but he probably wouldn't tell.
But... He also wouldn't tell anything I said to him. I don't think I've ever ever heard him divulge the contents of a conversation he's had. It would be nice to think that he would be different if the topic of the conversation was *me*. But he probably wouldn't.
So will you continue to see him for therapy for topics other than your old therapist? And continue to talk to him in EMDR about your feelings about your old therapist? But he doesn't want to talk to you anymore about the factual history with your old therapist?
Is that a correct summary?
Was it his idea or yours that you shouldn't talk about your old therapist? I don't think my therapist would ever tell me not to talk about something. If he didn't agree with me, he wouldn't pretend to, but he wouldn't tell me I couldn't talk about it. I don't quite understand that part.
Posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 18:40:44
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Lemonaide, posted by Dinah on August 7, 2008, at 18:23:05
I think when I say not talk about, I mean not do talk therapy, just do the EMDR. It was his idea because he believes I believe he can't control his counter-tranference on this, so it feels like he is defending my old T, than supporting me. Maybe he thinks I need to vent my anger, and he doesn't help that much. He also told me now he is worried that I write about therapy on line and on my blog, it is like walking on eggshells. He doesn't want it to get turned about that he said such and such about my old T. The thing is that he knows everything about my old T, there is nothing more to add, and I know he is tired of me talking about it, he kinda told me.
I just don't know, I am even thinking of just saying forget therapy period. It is getting to be such a hassle and I am not sure if it is helping me as much as it hurt me. Maybe I am just tired. But I am feeling different about my current T because of this. I did talk to a therapist today that I called the other day when I was upset with my old T, and I did like him on the phone. I just don't know, he doesn't do EMDR but a college within his group does.
I think it was a bad idea to get my T involved with talking to my old T, my old T only dogged on me, and now I feel like he feels differently about me.
Posted by raisinb on August 7, 2008, at 18:56:09
In reply to Re: Had my session today, posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 18:08:25
Sheesh, once he says it will hurt you, he might as well tell you what was said. I'd be irked about that.
Posted by twinleaf on August 7, 2008, at 19:33:49
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Dinah, posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 18:40:44
Hi Lemonaide..I think you have exceptionally good insight into your present situation with both your past and present therapists, and there do seem to be some red flags popping up.
You present therapist has always seemed so seasoned and professional, but he may have gotten knocked off-balance by what happened recently. He really should not be worried about your views of his counter-transference. He should also not worry about anything you write in a blog or on babble...provided you keep your therapists anonymous, and they know you'll do that.. He should also not set limits on what you say: if you need to talk about your former therapist, you should be able to do so as long as you need to. When it's truly over in your mind, you won't need to talk about it any longer. I guess these are the same things which are worrying you, too.
You were doing SO well with him prior to this episode about seeing the former therapist. I think you had a year and a half of really good work, with real progress, without any negatives that I can remember. I really do hope you can work things out with your present therapist now. If you can't, there is always the possibility of finding a new one. But you don't want to get into a repetitive situation where you can only go so far with one therapist before something causes you to fragment or rupture the alliance you have built up.
I know it's not easy to hear this, but I do think it is very threatening to therapists when they hear from patients that they may be sued, or that their words and actions may be publicly exposed on-line. At the moment, both of the therapists may be feeling a lot of pressure from that. Although it has not (yet) happened to me, I know, as a doctor, that it would be very threatening to me. and would make me want to tranfer any patient who did that. I certainly don't want to be unfairly tough on you, because I have always really liked and admired you, but do you think you could commit to not threatening the therapists with legal action or public exposure, thus inadvertently putting them on the defensive? If I am wrong about this, which I certainly could be, please let me know. I know this is a tough time now, and I don't want to make it any harder than it already is.
You have so many great things going for you. Both therapists seem to have really enjoyed and valued their work with you, and valued you as a person.. Is there a way to keep all those good things going, even while you deal with your anger and rage? (as we all must do).
I do hope this post doesn't seem unduly harsh to you, but if it is, tell me.
Posted by Dinah on August 8, 2008, at 17:50:34
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Dinah, posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 18:40:44
I've found at least three quarters of my learning and changing in therapy came from working on the relationship with my therapist. Learning to work through problems without sweeping them under the rug. As Twinleaf said, repairing the many ruptures that come in a relationship. Learning that I can be angry with him, and he can be angry with me, and our relationship can survive that. Learning to hold onto both caring and anger at once.
The benefits are far greater than just learning how to be in relationship with your therapist, or even learning how to be in relationship with anyone. There are also lessons in acceptance and disappointment and... well, I don't know. I just know that I'm not the same person now that I was.
If you think your current therapist is a decent person and a skilled enough therapist, I'd try to work it out with him rather than starting anew. The problem with starting anew is that you keep going over the same ground and don't find your way to the next level.
He may be upset right now about talk of lawyers and naming names on the internet. But in the context of a long term relationship, and as you prove yourself trustworthy to him, he will get past it. You say that you think your anger affects your relationships. Who better to work on it with than someone you think may be angry with you?
Of course I haven't been a fly on the wall in your therapy, so I may well be missing important aspects. That's the limitations of this type of forum.
Posted by gardenergirl on August 8, 2008, at 19:15:38
In reply to Had my session today, posted by Lemonaide on August 7, 2008, at 13:14:46
My eyes are crossed and my brain fried from trying to organize a boatload (pardon the pun) of info about an upcoming trip, but I wanted to tell you I was thinking of you.
Take care,
gg
Posted by Lemonaide on August 8, 2008, at 22:41:40
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Lemonaide, posted by raisinb on August 7, 2008, at 18:56:09
I kinda think so because I will always wonder what he said and I am sure in mind it will be so much worse. I have a feeling he said something that would upset me very much.
Posted by Lemonaide on August 8, 2008, at 22:50:20
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Lemonaide, posted by twinleaf on August 7, 2008, at 19:33:49
Hi Twinleaf,
Thanks for posting, I have thought so much about what you said, and decided to keep going to my T. He is good, and I think it is just a hard time for both of us. But with his memory, we will probably forget all of this in a month anyway. lol
I don't really need to bring this up to him again anyway. I wouldn't even mind if he looked in on what I was posting, it doesn't bother me. Except in the beginning I said he was an old geezer. lol
He has done over the top to help me in this. He told me that he needed to protect me from suffering more anguish if he could. Nobody has ever said that to me, I feel like I am in his big therapy nest. Even suggesting that I talk to another T to vent my feelings about my old T since he is sensitive to it or it appears to me that he is trying to protect my old T. It makes me angry with him when he won't confirm what my old T did. What T would be that honest about his ego and counter-transference? I have a good one, I need to keep him. You post made me see things from the outside, and I feel you are right. Thanks so much. I am kinda the just tell me what you think kinda girl. My T is always calling an ace a spade or whatever he says with me and it is something else I appreciate in therapy.
Posted by Lemonaide on August 8, 2008, at 23:00:26
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Lemonaide, posted by Dinah on August 8, 2008, at 17:50:34
Hi Dinah,
You said something in your post that made me stop and go ut oh. The disappointment that we can have in our T's. Wow that is a big issue to me.
I am starting to feel some disappointment, when you I read some of your posts about your T forgetting stuff. Well my T is getting like that and it hurts like hell sometimes. I think our ego gets stung a little when they forget. How can they? My T would say sorry and he is only human.
I told my T that he forgot a whole session where I talked about what a "soulmate" means to me, the spiritualities, the one word you told me that I forgot about things being connected at the same time, grrrrrrrrr. When I brought up in tears that I even lost my soul mate, he took it like a romantic thing, which it totally wasn't. I told him I had it with my grandma, and I am not lusting after her.
Well he really tried not to admit he forgot, but he did. But now I see where I can be disappointed in him. Which to me is a huge issue because I think everyone ends up disappointing us at one time or another, but I take it so personally.
I remember Muffy (where is she anyway?) She said her T said that the people who we love or trust the most, will be the ones who will hurt us the worst.
Thanks DInah for your awesome post!
Posted by Lemonaide on August 8, 2008, at 23:07:39
In reply to Re: Had my session today » Lemonaide, posted by gardenergirl on August 8, 2008, at 19:15:38
Hi GG,
Well I am jealous of you going on a trip. So are you one that plans every hour? I do when I take the family to Disney World.
Well thanks for taking time out of distress to support me! ;-)
Also remember to pack mole skin, band-aids and some great foot cream.
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.