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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 4 of 4. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by tecknohed on February 3, 2006, at 17:40:30
I have an addiction. Its not Heroin or crack. Nor is it a benzo or alcohol. Its caffeine.
Let me start by mentioning that I'm a recovering alcoholic 4 years sober after going through intensive rehab including detox, and I also have a long history of heavy amphetamine use as well as issues with the 'party' drugs. Anyone who's abused speed knows what a 'come down' is like. I mean, I 'know' what drug addiction is like.
But this caffeine addiction has really got me by the b#lls big time. Its actually making me lose my mind.
I already take Nardil 75mg/day for my SP, depression & OCD + 500mg/day of Provigil. And when I'm 'caffeine free' I do ok. But I cann't resist it.
When I drink caffeine I innitially get a GOOD high. More than that, it makes me feel totally well again, just like when Nardil first kicked in all by itself. Problem is it also comes with that all too familiar stimulant 'edginess' too.
Within 5 days of continuous caffeine use, it has NO EFFECT WHATSOEVER. In fact, the more I have, the more exhausted I feel. And it dont matter whether I've been using 1g/day or 150mg/day, the results always the same.But the worst part of all is the withdrawal. NEVER have I had withdrawal so bad. Not from anything. It only lasts up to 5 days, though I can rarely hack it that long. Severe depression, with lots of tearfullness & feeling hopeless with suicidal thoughts becoming more regular; total fatigue making me bed-ridden; NIGHTMARES (nasty ones); sweats; my OCD goes through the roof; and on top of this my meds dont help at all.
I constantly loose my temper, I neglect my hygien and my flat becomes a mess. I treat my girlfriend like crap, nagging her and blaming her for stuff.And today I did something awfull. I'd been withdrawing up untill last night when I had enough and had some caffeine. After a liitle sleep this morning I went into town to get some things, etc. I felt edgy but thought I'd first head for Starbucks to 'clear my head'. I ordered a triple espresso and sat down by a window overlooking a canal. I finnished my coffee and as I looked out the window I saw 3 kids, age 15-16 throwing what looked like bricks or large rocks at a swan. I instantly became severely angered at this and my mind & vision locked on them as they started over the bridge towards starbucks. As they neared I stood up, put on my coat and marched strait out the shop where I met them. I yelled at them about the swan, grabbed one of them by the collar, pinned him against the road railings and hit him right in the side of his head, hard.
Someone yelled at me so I walked off, steadily at first, as though proud I'd just carried out justice, but as I realized what I'd done I was soon legging it home. After all, I'd just commited assult on a juvenile! (I'm over 18). I know there is no excuse for violence. All I can say is the caffeine pushed me over the edge! Believe me or not, I'm not NORMALLY the violent type.As you can see I'm clearly loosing it. Yet my pdoc cant (wont) see the problem. I cant find a damn thing anywhere about such reactions, or intolerence to caffeine. But its getting beyond bad.
I've tried Clonazepam for withdrawal but it makes things worse not better. Maybe there's something else that can help the withdrawals, or even keep me abstinent from it. I'd certainly have a better chance if the Nardil did its thing again. But getting my pdoc to augment is like pulling teeth.
I've ordered some Lamotrigine online out of despiration, though some people say it can get Nardil going again - somewhat.Please add any thoughts or comments should you wish. I just wanted to post my problem 'cause its reaching boiling point and I cant get my head around much at the moment.
Posted by deirdrehbrt on February 3, 2006, at 22:17:03
In reply to Caffein making me 'mad', posted by tecknohed on February 3, 2006, at 17:40:30
First, I'm glad that you didn't seriously hurt the child. (I'm also glad the children didn't hurt the swan)
I'm coming off of caffiene too. I used to drink 2+ liters per day of Mt. Dew. Now I'm down to a cup or two of coffee per day. Tapering works for me because when I quit cold turkey I get incredible migraines.
I've never experienced violence from quitting though. I did get violent whild drinking, though I never hit anybody. I would throw things and yell and scream. I once threw a chair into my piano.
I think it might be worth talking to your doctor again, or maybe a therapist. Maybe you just need some other tools for dealing with your emotions now that you're clean. I think you were justified in approaching the kids about attempting to harm wildlife, but striking one of them could get you put in jail. If you have a therapist, that's who I would talk to about this. I don't know what I would do about mentioning the age of the person you struck becaues that is child abuse, and most states have a mandatory reporting law and you could still find yourself in some hot water over this.
Good luck,
--Dee
Posted by tecknohed on February 3, 2006, at 23:00:39
In reply to Re: Caffein making me 'mad', posted by deirdrehbrt on February 3, 2006, at 22:17:03
> First, I'm glad that you didn't seriously hurt the child. (I'm also glad the children didn't hurt the swan)
> I'm coming off of caffiene too. I used to drink 2+ liters per day of Mt. Dew. Now I'm down to a cup or two of coffee per day. Tapering works for me because when I quit cold turkey I get incredible migraines.
> I've never experienced violence from quitting though. I did get violent whild drinking, though I never hit anybody. I would throw things and yell and scream. I once threw a chair into my piano.
> I think it might be worth talking to your doctor again, or maybe a therapist. Maybe you just need some other tools for dealing with your emotions now that you're clean. I think you were justified in approaching the kids about attempting to harm wildlife, but striking one of them could get you put in jail. If you have a therapist, that's who I would talk to about this. I don't know what I would do about mentioning the age of the person you struck becaues that is child abuse, and most states have a mandatory reporting law and you could still find yourself in some hot water over this.
> Good luck,
> --DeeThanks for your input.
Believe me, I'm completely aware of the seriousness of my actions. I put my hands up - it was appalling and dangerous, physically (to the boy) and consequently (the trouble I could have/may still get into).
I dont expect people to keep thier opinions to themselves here, yet the reason I told of it was to not only show how much of a problem things are, but also to show myself the reality of it - by reading peoples responses. Other than that, what can I do about it now? (no, I wont shop myself to the police).It wasn't so much the withdrawal that caused the outburst, at least not directly. But I had been withdrawing for 2 days which had left me in a mind set I can only describe as 'dark'. And I can only theorise that the sudden dose of caffeine (probably 300mg+) powered that feeling and just took over (incidentally, I'm still wide awake from that dose 11hrs later). Had I had the espresso an hour before - plenty of time to lift my mood, I honestly think I would have reacted totally differently, and probably not even approached them at all. Having social phobia, approaching them would normally be the last thing I'd do no matter how lifted my mood was, especially as I find children of that age particularly panick-provoking in most situations.
Yes, I definitely need to talk to (hassle) my doctor again.
Posted by Mistermindmasta on February 4, 2006, at 11:19:07
In reply to Re: Caffein making me 'mad' » deirdrehbrt, posted by tecknohed on February 3, 2006, at 23:00:39
I can't say I have a reaction to caffeine exactly the same as yours, but I'd say it's almost identical as far as the severity of the reaction. The thing you gotta remember is that, just because 98% of the population can drink 4 cups of coffee with little problem doesn't mean everyone can. That part is pretty obvious, but what's not so obvious, on a different level, is that we all have a slightly different biochemical reaction to caffeine, based on variations in the adenosine receptors. I suspect that some people have a much stronger dopamine release as a result of activation of the adenosine receptor and that's why some people get addicted to it and have such difficulty with withdrawal. I know people who drink coffee all the time and have no noticable mood disorder upon withdrawal. A question that pops up, then, is: are other people unaware of their own shifts in moods? Are they equally as sensitive as me to caffeine but just aren't in tune with their body? I wish I knew the answer.
Anyway, for me, if caffeine didn't make me nervous (which is bad for social interaction), I'd say it was the only drug I'd ever need; I absolutely love caffeine. If you give me 4 cups of coffee in a row, I'd definitely be the one thinking hypomanic-ish thoughts, which I love... formulating all these expansive ideas for my house and life. In fact, one of the reasons I love caffeine is because of the confidence it gives me. I think I can accomplish anything, and the reality is, if I was on a caffeine buzz all the time, I probably COULD accomplish the things I think of. Too bad the buzz doesn't last all day!!! :(
This is the end of the thread.
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