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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 7 of 7. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by avid abulia on June 15, 2003, at 16:33:56
adapton is a french drug, an extract of a fish of the genus *garum*, which contains peptides converted into endorphins once in the brain. it is cheap to import, and has been shown to be effective in acute stress and in inattention, but little research has been done regarding effects on depression or other disorders.
DLPA is a mixture of the d- and l- isoforms of the amino acid phenylalanine. l-phenylalanine can be converted into the trace amine phenylethylamine, which is both a naturally occurring amine protected by MAO-B inhibitions, as well as a metabolite of the mixed-MAO inhibitor Nardil. it can also be converted to the non-essential amino acid tyrosine, which is necessary to produce dopamine, adrenaline, and noradrenaline, as well as thyroxine. the d-phenylalanine is an inhibitor of enkephalin breakdown, and DLPA has had clinical studies showing it`s efficacy as an antidepressant and also for inattention and chronic pain, BUT as it contains a d-isoform of an amino acid, i am wondering if anyone knows if it has long-term toxicity? i have been unable to find any indications one way or the other.
as i am unable to take either conventional antidepressants or conventional stimulants because of a seizure disorder, and i have a chronic though episodic pain disorder with no real treatment available, i am wondering if anyone here has tried these, what their experiences were, and if they think potential benefits outweigh potential risks in my situation.
~AA
Posted by linkadge on June 15, 2003, at 18:04:47
In reply to adapton or DLPA experiences or knowledge?, posted by avid abulia on June 15, 2003, at 16:33:56
I have not heard of it. But I do know that traditional fish oil supplements. Ie EPA and DHA supplementation can provide relief of both Epilepsy and Depression.
Linkadge
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 15, 2003, at 18:48:00
In reply to adapton or DLPA experiences or knowledge?, posted by avid abulia on June 15, 2003, at 16:33:56
> adapton is a french drug, an extract of a fish of the genus *garum*, which contains peptides converted into endorphins once in the brain. it is cheap to import, and has been shown to be effective in acute stress and in inattention, but little research has been done regarding effects on depression or other disorders.
I'll look into this, as I'm curious.
> DLPA is a mixture of the d- and l- isoforms of the amino acid phenylalanine. l-phenylalanine can be converted into the trace amine phenylethylamine, which is both a naturally occurring amine protected by MAO-B inhibitions, as well as a metabolite of the mixed-MAO inhibitor Nardil. it can also be converted to the non-essential amino acid tyrosine, which is necessary to produce dopamine, adrenaline, and noradrenaline, as well as thyroxine. the d-phenylalanine is an inhibitor of enkephalin breakdown, and DLPA has had clinical studies showing it`s efficacy as an antidepressant and also for inattention and chronic pain, BUT as it contains a d-isoform of an amino acid, i am wondering if anyone knows if it has long-term toxicity? i have been unable to find any indications one way or the other.
There is no reason to think that d-aminos are toxic. Fermentation of all sorts produces them. About 8% of the aminos in beer are d-isomers, for example.
I have seen no evidence of any adverse effects of d-phenylalanine. Quite the contrary, in fact, as your own inquiry has demonstrated.
> as i am unable to take either conventional antidepressants or conventional stimulants because of a seizure disorder, and i have a chronic though episodic pain disorder with no real treatment available, i am wondering if anyone here has tried these, what their experiences were, and if they think potential benefits outweigh potential risks in my situation.
>
> ~AAI like the effect of DLPA in my brain. Given your health concerns, I'd recommend that you "start low, and go slow", i.e. small initial dose (500 mg?), and small increases over time.
Lar
Posted by avid abulia on June 15, 2003, at 23:32:34
In reply to Re: adapton or DLPA experiences or knowledge? » avid abulia, posted by Larry Hoover on June 15, 2003, at 18:48:00
> > adapton is a french drug, an extract of a fish of the genus *garum*, which contains peptides converted into endorphins once in the brain. it is cheap to import, and has been shown to be effective in acute stress and in inattention, but little research has been done regarding effects on depression or other disorders.
>
> I'll look into this, as I'm curious.as regards both this and the first response, adapton contains some EPA, and i have found fish oils to (so far) be the most helpful thing for my moods (lamictal helps some, but i get a much better effect from the combination).
>
>
> There is no reason to think that d-aminos are toxic. Fermentation of all sorts produces them. About 8% of the aminos in beer are d-isomers, for example.some d-isoforms (for instance, d-arginine and d-aspartic acid) are extremely toxic and responsible for some of the symptoms of bacterial diseases, whereas others are benign... i was just wondering if someone had info to contradict what i have seen regarding safety of this particular d-isoform.
>
> I have seen no evidence of any adverse effects of d-phenylalanine. Quite the contrary, in fact, as your own inquiry has demonstrated.
>
> > as i am unable to take either conventional antidepressants or conventional stimulants because of a seizure disorder, and i have a chronic though episodic pain disorder with no real treatment available, i am wondering if anyone here has tried these, what their experiences were, and if they think potential benefits outweigh potential risks in my situation.
> >
> > ~AA
>
> I like the effect of DLPA in my brain. Given your health concerns, I'd recommend that you "start low, and go slow", i.e. small initial dose (500 mg?), and small increases over time.
>
> Larsounds good, i think i will go for it!
~AA
Posted by linkadge on June 16, 2003, at 16:38:12
In reply to Re: adapton or DLPA experiences or knowledge? » Larry Hoover, posted by avid abulia on June 15, 2003, at 23:32:34
You may experiment with folic acid supplementation. By itself, this vitamin has antidepressant properties. Some studies show that Lamictal (like some other anticonvulsants) can lower stores of this vitamin) This may be why Lamictal's AD properties can poop out for some.
Linkadge
Posted by samplemethod on June 23, 2003, at 7:54:03
In reply to Re: adapton or DLPA experiences or knowledge? » avid abulia, posted by Larry Hoover on June 15, 2003, at 18:48:00
Can someone please give evidence that it is actually the d-form (and not the l-form) of phenylalanine that is an inhibitor of enkephalin breakdown?
Cheers
> > adapton is a french drug, an extract of a fish of the genus *garum*, which contains peptides converted into endorphins once in the brain. it is cheap to import, and has been shown to be effective in acute stress and in inattention, but little research has been done regarding effects on depression or other disorders.
>
> I'll look into this, as I'm curious.
>
> > DLPA is a mixture of the d- and l- isoforms of the amino acid phenylalanine. l-phenylalanine can be converted into the trace amine phenylethylamine, which is both a naturally occurring amine protected by MAO-B inhibitions, as well as a metabolite of the mixed-MAO inhibitor Nardil. it can also be converted to the non-essential amino acid tyrosine, which is necessary to produce dopamine, adrenaline, and noradrenaline, as well as thyroxine. the d-phenylalanine is an inhibitor of enkephalin breakdown, and DLPA has had clinical studies showing it`s efficacy as an antidepressant and also for inattention and chronic pain, BUT as it contains a d-isoform of an amino acid, i am wondering if anyone knows if it has long-term toxicity? i have been unable to find any indications one way or the other.
>
> There is no reason to think that d-aminos are toxic. Fermentation of all sorts produces them. About 8% of the aminos in beer are d-isomers, for example.
>
> I have seen no evidence of any adverse effects of d-phenylalanine. Quite the contrary, in fact, as your own inquiry has demonstrated.
>
> > as i am unable to take either conventional antidepressants or conventional stimulants because of a seizure disorder, and i have a chronic though episodic pain disorder with no real treatment available, i am wondering if anyone here has tried these, what their experiences were, and if they think potential benefits outweigh potential risks in my situation.
> >
> > ~AA
>
> I like the effect of DLPA in my brain. Given your health concerns, I'd recommend that you "start low, and go slow", i.e. small initial dose (500 mg?), and small increases over time.
>
> Lar
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 24, 2003, at 10:44:18
In reply to Re: adapton or DLPA experiences Avid Abulia » Larry Hoover, posted by samplemethod on June 23, 2003, at 7:54:03
> Can someone please give evidence that it is actually the d-form (and not the l-form) of phenylalanine that is an inhibitor of enkephalin breakdown?
>
> CheersThere's a bunch of similar, repetitive older research (samples here), and one recent reference, showing that at least one doctor has been paying attention.
I'm out of here for a while.
Lar
Acupunct Electrother Res. 1982;7(2-3):157-72.
D-phenylalanine and other enkephalinase inhibitors as pharmacological agents: implications for some important therapeutic application.
Ehrenpreis S.
A number of compounds have been shown to inhibit the degradation of enkephalins. As expected, these compounds produce naloxone reversible analgesia and potentiate the analgesia produced by enkephalins and by acupuncture. One of these, D-phenylalanine, is also anti-inflammatory. D-phenylalanine has proven to be beneficial in many human patients with chronic, intractable pain. It is proposed the enkephalinase inhibitors may be effective in a number of human "endorphin deficiency diseases" such as depression, schizophrenia, convulsive disorders and arthritis. Such compounds may alleviate other conditions associated with decreased endorphin levels such as opiate withdrawal symptoms.
Acupunct Electrother Res. 1985;10(3):203-8.Pharmacology of enkephalinase inhibitors: animal and human studies.
Ehrenpreis S.
We have shown that a number of compounds which inhibit the degradation of met-enkephalin can produce naloxone-reversible analgesia in mice. These compounds also potentiate the analgesia produced by acupuncture, foot shock, and transcutaneous nerve stimulation in animals and humans. The potency of their effectiveness as analgesics or potentiators parallels their potency as inhibitors of mouse brain enkephalinase. D-Phenylalanine (DPA), one of these enkephalinase inhibitors, has been used successfully for the management of chronic intractable pain in humans and to potentiate the treatment of many painful conditions by acupuncture. Other aspects of pharmacology of DPA will be discussed, including its effects on the cardio-vascular system, behavior, and lack of development of tolerance and dependence when used chronically in animals and humans.
Med Hypotheses. 2000 Oct;55(4):283-8.
DL-phenylalanine markedly potentiates opiate analgesia - an example of nutrient/pharmaceutical up-regulation of the endogenous analgesia system.Russell AL, McCarty MF.
Brampton Pain Clinic, Bramalea, Ontario, Canada.
In the author's clinical experience, concurrent treatment with DL-phenylalanine (DLPA) often appears to potentiate pain relief and also ease depression in patients receiving opiates for chronic non-malignant pain. An analysis of this phenomenon suggests that it may be mediated, at least in part, by up-regulation of the 'endogenous analgesia system' (EAS), a neural pathway that projects caudally from medullary nuclei to the dorsal horn of the spinal column; when stimulated by chronic pain or therapeutic measures such as opiates or acupuncture, the EAS suppresses activation of second-order pain-receptive neurons in the dorsal horn, and thereby alleviates pain. Since serotonin and enkephalins are key neurotransmitters in the EAS, it is reasonable to predict that measures which promote serotonin activity (such as 5-hydroxytryptophan and serotonin-reuptake inhibitors) as well as enkephalin activity (such as D-phenylalanine, an enkephalinase inhibitor) should potentiate EAS-mediated analgesia - a view consistent with much previous medical research. Comprehensive support of the EAS with well-tolerated nutrients and pharmaceuticals may amplify the analgesic efficacy of chronic opiate therapy, while enabling dosage reductions that minimize opiate side-effects. Analogously, this approach may complement the efficacy of acupuncture and other analgesic measures that activate the EAS.
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