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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by cockeyed on September 5, 2005, at 0:33:59
I'm an alcoholic. I stayed sober for ten yrs.
But these days I like getting wasted on cheap vodka. Sober, I'm a pain in the *rse: loaded, I'm a pain in the *ss.
But the *rse side of me is a pain in the *ss.
The *ss side of me is, well, happier. Whatever that is.
Sober life sucks. inebriated life is a party.
It's become a serious problem with my family.
I stop drinking, then i start again. Because I feel good, rather than serious. If I could be delerious I'd be ....well, me.
If this sounds like horseshit: it is. I can deal with this world drunk. But sober...Xrist I
don't know why, but life seems to be hell.
Booze removes the slog thru the sh*t and I'd
like to be rid of it. And my answer is a coupla shots.
As noted this is B.S. I should stay sober.
That said, I can't.
I'll try A.A again, but the god squad makes me take a walk. And blah, blah, blah. I'd go on and on. And on and on.
It pisses me off but I like being drunk.
cockeyed
Posted by ClearSkies on September 5, 2005, at 6:57:09
In reply to B.S amd more B..S., posted by cockeyed on September 5, 2005, at 0:33:59
> I'll try A.A again, but the god squad makes me take a walk. And blah, blah, blah. I'd go on and on. And on and on.
I have a tough time with swallowing the AA line, too. I'm *trying* to take the good in what I hear and leave the b.s. behind In The Rooms as they say. I don't go for it hook line and sinker. I did that once, 5 years ago - stayed sober but was a miserable git and ended up feeling like I betrayed my very soul. Also ended up getting drunker than a skunk.
Now I'm doing it on MY terms. Just not telling them so.
Plus I'm getting my support from several different places, not just AA. It helps to balance the message out. When it gets too bad I can sit with my fingers in my ears and say "la la la la la". Give me another cup of bad coffee and a donut, puh-leese.
ClearSkies
Posted by alexandra_k on September 5, 2005, at 16:29:02
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S. » cockeyed, posted by ClearSkies on September 5, 2005, at 6:57:09
yeah i had trouble with NA too...
with a 'higher power' that increasingly resembles the christian god with each step...
with the 30 day 60 day 90 day tags...:-(
Posted by TexasChic on September 5, 2005, at 19:27:37
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S., posted by alexandra_k on September 5, 2005, at 16:29:02
I'm so glad to hear other people saying this. I would never bash someone's elses beliefs. I think everyone is intitled to their own, and I have the upmost respect for the Christian faith. But it seems like a person is looked down upon in modern society if you aren't a Christian. I was raised in a super strict religious family with a preacher for a father. Believe me, I've done the research.
Is there any 12 step program for a non-christian?
-T
Posted by alexandra_k on September 5, 2005, at 22:48:25
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S., posted by TexasChic on September 5, 2005, at 19:27:37
there is rational recovery
but its hard to tell whether aa/na or cbt is worse ;-)
Posted by Declan on September 5, 2005, at 23:39:03
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S. ?TexasChic, posted by alexandra_k on September 5, 2005, at 22:48:25
The prospect of AA and NA are enough to compel moderation from me. I simply could not do that, I dunno why.
These chemicals are what I've used to cope with people and I can't use people to cope with the chemicals.
As for the ideas, steps and so on, forget it.
But it's probably a temperament thing.
I can't see why you would choose to be with people to talk about drug use to be with people. Better to walk around the Andes by yourself or something.
Declan
Posted by alexandra_k on September 6, 2005, at 0:06:51
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S., posted by Declan on September 5, 2005, at 23:39:03
LOL!!!
You are funny :-)
I went and did a couple drug treatment programs... We had to go to aa/na at least 3x per week.
and i loathed and detested it.
i appreciate that different people have different experiences and it helps a lot of people etc etc
BUT
i just found a whole bunch of people who got together and talked of their past and present lives in a comperable manner to pentecostals talking of their old sinful ways and their rebirth into a child of god.
religious cult.
nobody would work with the addicts.
aa/na stepped in and would work with them.and that was a very good thing
and they helped a lot of peoplebut the b*llshit perspective that aa/na abstenence and devoting ones life to carrying out the will of ones higher power is the ONLY way is... b*llshit.
i don't know how religion got all messed up with treatment for addiction...
more work needs to be done with secular programs.
in particular i quite like the sound of a skinnerian token economy for recovery. i could make my fortune :-)
Posted by ClearSkies on September 6, 2005, at 6:03:49
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S. » Declan, posted by alexandra_k on September 6, 2005, at 0:06:51
The Women For Sobriety group I belong to is a great place for support and recovery, based on improving self esteem and piling up the positives in our lives. (Not just alcohol, also helps with other chemical addictions.)
I needed more than one meeting a week to hang on to my tenuous sobriety. Now we are getting together socially - omigod, GAD me! - during the week, to keep in touch and bolster our strengths.
I don't care for their website but the face to face value has been incalculable for me.
CS
Posted by AuntieMel on September 6, 2005, at 19:59:20
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S. » Declan, posted by alexandra_k on September 6, 2005, at 0:06:51
Not all aa/na groups are that into religeon.
I was told a 'higher power' could be anything - even a doorknob if you wanted. I wore a jade necklace and when I would start feeling like drinking I would hold it. It sounds silly, but it got me through. I've been sober for over 2 yrs now.
Posted by alexandra_k on September 6, 2005, at 21:38:14
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S. » alexandra_k, posted by AuntieMel on September 6, 2005, at 19:59:20
> Not all aa/na groups are that into religeon.
yeah. a lot depends on the particular people who are the regular attenders.
> I was told a 'higher power' could be anything - even a doorknob if you wanted.
yeah. i've been told that too. and that works okay for... is it the second step? i forget the steps... point is that as you progress through the steps your conception of your higher power has to become a conception of a beneficient intelligent agency...
if someone can find me the steps i'll show you...
but: it does work for some people. and that is terrific. and some people find aa/na helps them like nothing else has ever managed to do. and that is terrific too.i just think...
that there are alternative ways. i mean that in the sense that you can be an aa/na drop out and still make headway on your problem...
abstinence is controversial...
and so is addiction the disease...
Posted by Ilene on September 7, 2005, at 22:31:17
In reply to B.S amd more B..S., posted by cockeyed on September 5, 2005, at 0:33:59
Have you heard of Rational Recovery? It's an alternative to AA/NA, etc. Try googling it.
I.
Posted by muffled on September 8, 2005, at 22:02:02
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S., posted by Ilene on September 7, 2005, at 22:31:17
I'm a christian, but couldn't do A.A. Just brought me down. Was a bit of a meatmarket too. I been sober for mebbe 10 or so years, not counting really. Haven't drank since I had kids.I did govt. alcohol counselling, I did the antabuse thing ( got SOOOOOOO sick), but just figgered ways around that. Did treatment center, was good, educational about all that denial stuff. But what REALLY happened, and I don't to this day really know why, is that alcohol just stopped working. SH*T. Beleive me, I tried EVERYTHING you could poss. think of.EVERYTHING. I was finally hospitalized when I was gonna blow my head off cuz I didn't wanto live w/o booze. It was EVERYTHING to me. My LIFE.Freaking stuff bailed on me. I still struggle. I still feel sometimes like I been punched in the gut , with the WANTING. But if I drink, I lose my kids. GUARANTEED. So, somehow I don't.I love my kids, even more than alcohol(if it worked anymore-no way of finding out). I dream of being an old drunk lady, and I'll drink myself to death when I'm old. That is my dream. Mebbe it will work for me again after that many years. I'm such a f*cking nut. But SOMEONE is watching out for me. My higher power perhaps? I have no explanation.
Posted by Donna Louise on September 21, 2005, at 19:59:22
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S. » alexandra_k, posted by ClearSkies on September 6, 2005, at 6:03:49
> The Women For Sobriety group I belong to is a great place for support and recovery, based on improving self esteem and piling up the positives in our lives. (Not just alcohol, also helps with other chemical addictions.)
>
> I needed more than one meeting a week to hang on to my tenuous sobriety. Now we are getting together socially - omigod, GAD me! - during the week, to keep in touch and bolster our strengths.
>
> I don't care for their website but the face to face value has been incalculable for me.
> CSHey CC, I am appreciating your posts very much. I have been sober in AA for 20 years somehow but I no longer feel like I belong either. At 5 years it became apparant that I had to take prozac and I had to be nearly house bound before I would do that. Thanks to good Dr. I finally took it and became able to function without drugs and alcohol. But I always felt like I was 'cheating" due to the message (that is not AA) from some who think they know the "will of god" for me! Anyway, as time has gone on I have had to take more drugs including the monster benzo and now I am sure I am judged. I like how you say you are doing it on your own terms. Only those I am closest to know but then of course I have the "guilty secret"! Agh. I wish there was a type of meeting in my area where those of us who are staying sober and taking meds could get together in an arena of support and understanding. After all that, what I meant to just ask was where do you find the women's group that you are going to now?
Thanks so much,
Donna
Posted by ClearSkies on September 21, 2005, at 20:49:14
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S., posted by Donna Louise on September 21, 2005, at 19:59:22
This is where I started my search:
http://www.womenforsobriety.org/
I actually spoke with the local meeting's facilitator a year before I screwed up the courage to actually go to a meeting. I wasn't sure if it was the right thing/place/people for me and was too scared to try.
But - knowing that everything happens when it's supposed to happen, I've been going to a weekly meeting since June, and it feels like coming home.
BTW I think the website is kind of hokey but it will start the ball rolling for you!!
ClearSkies
Posted by Sebastian on October 8, 2005, at 18:26:20
In reply to B.S amd more B..S., posted by cockeyed on September 5, 2005, at 0:33:59
I go in and out of drinking spells. Drink every day for a couple years stop for a couple and start again.
Posted by greenhornet on October 26, 2005, at 10:55:17
In reply to Re: B.S amd more B..S., posted by Donna Louise on September 21, 2005, at 19:59:22
> > The Women For Sobriety group I belong to is a great place for support and recovery, based on improving self esteem and piling up the positives in our lives. (Not just alcohol, also helps with other chemical addictions.)
> >
> > I needed more than one meeting a week to hang on to my tenuous sobriety. Now we are getting together socially - omigod, GAD me! - during the week, to keep in touch and bolster our strengths.
> >
> > I don't care for their website but the face to face value has been incalculable for me.
> > CS
>
> Hey CC, I am appreciating your posts very much. I have been sober in AA for 20 years somehow but I no longer feel like I belong either. At 5 years it became apparant that I had to take prozac and I had to be nearly house bound before I would do that. Thanks to good Dr. I finally took it and became able to function without drugs and alcohol. But I always felt like I was 'cheating" due to the message (that is not AA) from some who think they know the "will of god" for me! Anyway, as time has gone on I have had to take more drugs including the monster benzo and now I am sure I am judged. I like how you say you are doing it on your own terms. Only those I am closest to know but then of course I have the "guilty secret"! Agh. I wish there was a type of meeting in my area where those of us who are staying sober and taking meds could get together in an arena of support and understanding. After all that, what I meant to just ask was where do you find the women's group that you are going to now?
>
> Thanks so much,
>
> Donna
>
I too am an "ex AA" twenty-five years in "the program, and one day I announced at the end of the meeting that I felt that I had been healed, and since I could no longer say "I am an alcoholic" I would not be back
My church has a support group for healed ex-drunks. And it is wonderful!
This is the end of the thread.
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